[FRIAM] narcissism

[uǝlƃ ☣]

Well, to be clear, the journal articles I've seen *indicate* that the grandiose one's don't suffer much. I wouldn't know one way or another. I'm just going off what I read in the articles.

And I apologize in advance, but without *some* evidence in support of what you're saying, it's impossible for me to incorporate. The question I'm asking is: Are they the same people just presenting differently? Or are they really 2 different types of person? I'm seriously asking that. And as I (and Steve) have mentioned, it's reasonable to HYPOTHESIZE that there are 2 modes, or some kind of self-presentation mechanism menu from which the narcissist chooses. So I really am asking the question.

You're not asking that question. You're *answering* that question without providing any evidence to justify your answer. I appreciate the conversation a lot. But it's the evidence (and the structure/type of that evidence) that I care about. If you don't provide any evidence to back up your opinions, I'm at a loss. And, also to be clear, a book from 1975 won't be very good evidence for or against a distinction that seems to have been made in the literature in 1991. I'd love to find a critical "debunking" of the type distinction. That's what I'm looking for. But all I see are confirmations of the 2 types.


On 4/29/20 2:09 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:
> By the way, you say
> 
> ...that grandiose narcissists *don't* suffer much, but the vulnerable narcissists *do*...  
> 
> Grandiosity is a defense against vulnerability in these people.  They're the same people.  
> 
> I find Kernberg to be more masterful and credible that Yeomans.  Of course, the former is the teacher of the latter.
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, Apr 29, 2020 at 2:59 PM Frank Wimberly <wimberly3 at gmail.com <mailto:wimberly3 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>         Here, Yeomans refers to what I started this thread with, he thinks narcissists suffer a lot, enslaved in an isolation. But the research I've seen in journals indicate that grandiose narcissists *don't* suffer much, but the vulnerable narcissists *do*. This is directly inferrable from the *alternative* model of NPD in the DSM 5. And it's reflected to some extent in pretty much any paper you get from a google scholar search.


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