[FRIAM] NO LANL IN SANTA FE! Wednesday, 12; 00 outside SF City Hall; bring friends

Wed Jan 15 09:14:08 EST 2020

I wonder how the Study Group would feel about nuclear reactors, however
small, near the intersection of St Michaels and Cerrillos.

-----------------------------------
Frank Wimberly

My memoir:
https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly

My scientific publications:
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2

Phone (505) 670-9918

On Wed, Jan 15, 2020, 5:53 AM Prof David West <profwest at fastmail.fm> wrote:

> Eric,
>
> How about establishing a Galactic Library?
>
> Inspiration comes from a myriad of science fiction novels.
>
> Would subsume Wikipedia, the WWW, Project Gutenberg and Google's book
> digitization project, all the knowledge bases currently behind pay walls.
> the government document storage center currently in Pueblo Colorado, etc.
> etc.
>
> Would employ the best and brightest from library and information science,
> knowledge visualization, cognitive theorists, etc. etc. — not to mention
> knowledge creators like artists and authors.
>
> Knowledge rescue missions led by anthropologists would recover languages,
> folk knowledge, etc that has not been recorded and will be lost.
>
> Local universities might specialize in producing people capable of new
> disciplines of ordinology and synthesis, polymaths, and reference
> librarians.
>
> You could include computer folk, if and only if, they took some kind of
> "Engelbart Pledge" that their work would enhance and augment human
> abilities instead of demeaning/replacing them.
>
> Biggest obstacle would be power. Highly probably that it would have to
> come from nuclear -—maybe those refrigerator size reactors that a company
> in Albuquerque and Oregon have been working on.
>
> Entirely new ways of thinking about knowledge and wisdom would need to be
> developed. (The computer science notions of data, databases, and
> information must be discarded as harmful.)
>
> Could incorporate myriad Bohm Dialogues..
>
> Could be a massive source of innovative ideas for development outside the
> Library.
>
> davew
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 14, 2020, at 10:03 PM, David Eric Smith wrote:
> > I think I have been influenced on preferred frames for this question by
> > two sources in particular.
> >
> > One was the writing Krugman did in the 1970s-90s on economic geography,
> > which translating into my own current language is very much a
> > perspective of institutional ecology with an emphasis on critical mass
> > effects and what have become popular to call tipping points. If you
> > don’t have something like a protected bay, a waterway, or other
> > geographic feature to nucleate a distributed growth dynamic, critical
> > mass is often achieved by the actions of large atomic (in the sense of
> > indivisible, not meaning related to nuclear physics) actors, who can
> > act on large scale in inidivual moves.  The examples he always trotted
> > out at the beginnings of essays were Burlington NC for textiles, or
> > coastal Washington for aircraft (we’ll see how long that persists given
> > current management, but for the last half of the previous century…)
> >
> > The second source came through Martin Shubik, and was the work of the
> > Swedish development economist Gunnar Eliasson.  Eliasson’s work was
> > specifically on the long-term design and strategy problem of where a
> > government would allocate resources if it understood from the start
> > that much of the output would need to be handed off to distributed or
> > private developers, but (in the sense of the economic idea of
> > “mechanism design”) it wanted that distributed development to achieve a
> > specific social goal, not just to be whatever-happens-next.  The point
> > in this work is that only looking at the large action by one actor at
> > the beginning doesn’t solve a problem; it’s embedding that action in
> > follow-through and having a longer-term plan.  I think this is to Ed
> > Angel’s point that LANL as a stand-alone achieves a large distortion,
> > but doesn’t change the opportunities of the region around it in
> > self-sustaining ways.
> >
> > I know the members on this list mostly don’t have powers of
> > implementation, but as idle intellectual exercise, if you/we were
> > portfolio managers, or really avant-garde regional planners, what would
> > your design look like to get through critical mass thresholds to tip an
> > interior, water-limited, relatively low-population region into some
> > kind of self-maintaining decent standard of life and opportunity for
> > whoever lived there stably for a long time.  (And how many can that be,
> > in water-limited regions?)  Intel made a significant impact in ABQ, but
> > putting a semiconductor fab in a desert is about as unsustainable a
> > business decision as I can imagine.  What resources exist currently?
> > If you were designing the institutional ecosystem, and knew you needed
> > some economic social function but couldn’t find an actor to fit it,
> > could you define in somewhat operational terms what that function would
> > need to be, and how much of the remainder of the context could you
> > populate with specific actors and a plan to get them into place?
> >
> > I know this is much too loose and long-term to deal with immediate
> > practicalities of interacting wtih the SF city council, but we often
> > speak as if long-term future visioning efforts could in principle yield
> > something useful.
> >
> > Eric
> >
> >
> > > On Jan 15, 2020, at 4:30 AM, <thompnickson2 at gmail.com> <
> thompnickson2 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Ach!
> > >
> > > I glad we are talking about this.  It is the kind of issue that we, in
> particular, ought to think up and speak out about.  My own impulse would be
> to entertain the possibility of a LANL-SF, but negotiate some sort of
> arrangement, say, perhaps, that no classified work could be done in here.
>
> > >
> > > But now I have heard from several voices that I respect deeply, each
> speaking from very different kinds of experience, and all appearing to
> agree that even in the absence of War Heads, hosting a national laboratory
> would not benefit Santa Fe.  But what are the alternatives?  In other
> words, are the ills you identify inherent to all human institutions, or
> really only inherent to government ones.  Would it be better if CMU put a
> campus here?  I have heard many of you express the same doubts about
> universities.  Would it be better if Google or Amazon put a campus here?
> Why?  Why are large for-profit institutions more to be trusted than
> government and academic ones?  At least with government institutions there
> is the possibility of regulating them by popular will.  Amazon, not so
> much.   Is your position that EVERY institution should be so small we can
> drown it in a bathtub?  So, set the threshold for anti trust action VERY
> low.  How bout this:  every corporation with more than a billion dollars in
> assets must place 5 percent of its annual income in a trust fund to
> encourage competing start ups.   Well, OK, split the College of Santa Fe
> campus up. Give it to ten different real estate firms with instructions
> that they must work independently.   Treat it as a hazard, rather than an
> opportunity.
> > >
> > > I heard a similar proposal for a solution to the truth problem on the
> internet.  Every retweet over ten-thousand contributes funds a conterarian
> tweet on the same stream.  In fact, how about a retweet limit on all
> messages.  No message can be retweeted more than ten-thousand times.
> > >
> > > Nick
> > > Nicholas Thompson
> > > Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
> > > Clark University
> > > ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com
> > > https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/
> > >
> > >
> > > From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> On Behalf Of Steven A Smith
> > > Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2020 11:48 AM
> > > To: friam at redfish.com
> > > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Fwd: NO LANL IN SANTA FE! Wednesday, 12; 00
> outside SF City Hall; bring friends
> > >
> > > Merle, et al -
> > > Though I reject most of the extreme arguments I hear on both sides of
> this issue, my instinct is that it would be better if Santa Fe did NOT
> invite LANL/NNSA into the development of this critical/central/prime
> location in the heart of *greater* Santa Fe.
> > > I've been living in a variant of this  high-dimensional, nonlinear,
> sometimes subtle and nuanced question all of my (adult) life.   I came to
> LANL at 24 as a technophilic peacenik who believed MAD made sense (1980)
> and was happy to ensure that WE had the BIG STICK.  I raised two children
> In Los Alamos and finally left in 2008 (27 years later) after Bechtel took
> over, remaining in the region and in high-tech work.   Along the way I was
> confronted with *many* changes in the international political, cultural and
> scientific landscape.   The end of the Cold War and nuclear testing, a
> nuclear arms-race between India/Pakistan, two Gulf Wars, a deep and abiding
> awareness of the reality and threat of Climate Change (and other parallel
> Endogenous Existential Threats).
> > > I went through a few personal transformations as well, including
> shepherding my two daughters into maturity along the way.  My opinions have
> become much stronger, broader and more nuanced over the years and I am
> thankful to have had the perspective offered through the rich gradients
> formed by our "tri-cultural heritage".   LANL is much more/less than a
> traditional "Anglo" company town and the work that goes on there is much
> more/less than virtually any other facility.  Adding Pu Pit production has
> expanded that yet more, while the unfathomably deep explorations into what
> may very well represent an array of  other technological *existential
> threats*.  Possibly equally important sociopolitically, is the role of
> Santa Fe (and San Juan Pueblo before it) as a locus of European Conquest,
> including the Pueblo Revolt (I can see Black Mesa from my window as I
> type).
> > > I agree with most of Ed's assertions about the variability of quality
> of the work at LANL, and certainly question the average "value received"
> with such outrageous overheads and oft isolated efforts.  I also agree with
> his summary of the net socioeconomic impact on the region/state.   While I
> was (am via legacy savings and local available services) a beneficiary of
> the very large amount of money pumped into the region, I see the
> deleterious effects of it.
> > > With my renewed interest and awareness in the "Endogenous Existential
> Threats" of our time, I am more sensitive to the callousness of many of the
> people and programs at LANL toward the local and global environment.   The
> bulk of the memoir Frank urged me to write (to save the list from my
> TMI/TL;DR posts?) would be armatured around this braid of interesting (in
> every sense of the word) paradoxes and contradictions.
> > > I think New Mexico's legacy around Science and Technology is real and
> meaningful, but has also been highly distorted by the influence of
> government (and specifically Defense-related) money.
> > > Carry On,
> > >  - Steve
> > > On 1/13/20 2:41 PM, Merle Lefkoff wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> > >> From: Leslie Lakind <leftielakind at gmail.com>
> > >> Date: Mon, Jan 13, 2020 at 2:23 PM
> > >> Subject: NO LANL IN SANTA FE! Wednesday, 12;00 outside SF City Hall;
> bring friends
> > >> To:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> > >> From: Greg Mello <gmello at lasg.org>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Permalink for this letter. Please forward! Other Letters
> > >> Home page; Press Releases; Bulletins;
> > >> To subscribe to our Friends listserve (formerly by invitation only)
> send a blank email here. To unsubscribe send a blank email here.
> > >> To subscribe to our Main listserve (less content, less frequent) send
> a blank email here. To unsubscribe send a blank email here.
> > >> Our blog (makeover coming!): Remember your Humanity. Twitter:
> @TrishABQ.
> > >> Contribute. Volunteer. Contact us (Greg and Trish in our main office,
> Lydia Clark in our Santa Fe office)
> > >> This letter: Press conference outside Santa Fe City Hall at noon on
> Wednesday Jan. 15 (map) -- please come, and please recruit others
> > >> Dear New Mexico friends –
> > >> As we have explained in previous letters, Wednesday is the day on
> which the City will announce the finalists for "Master Developer" of the
> former College of Santa Fe site (and possibly surrounding properties as
> well, a 64- to ~100-acre project). The National Nuclear Security
> Administration (NNSA) has applied for this role. NNSA and/or Los Alamos
> National Laboratory (LANL) are present in some (not all) other proposals,
> as tenant(s).
> > >> The situation is opaque, fluid, and developing. So far, Mayor Webber
> has disdainfully rebuffed our requests to meet or discuss the momentous
> social, cultural, and economic development impacts of placing a nuclear
> weapons campus in Santa Fe. (Don't be deceived -- that is exactly what LANL
> is and what this would be.)
> > >> People power may be the only force stronger than LANL's money and
> corruption. We really need you to help us expand our numbers.
> > >> If you live anywhere nearby please come to this joint press
> conference, and please ask as many friends to come as possible. Sheer
> attendance matters. A strong showing Wednesday will save countless hours of
> work later, and will give wings to efforts to push back on LANL's entirely
> unjustified expansion. There are many powerful people in Washington who
> know LANL specializes in taxpayer ripoffs. Some of them need to see some
> spine from us out here to take to their bosses.
> > >> New Mexico is being selected to be a nuclear weapons support and
> sacrifice area. That now includes the Santa Fe metro area.
> > >> We may not know know the outcome of this first Midtown Campus
> decision by noon Wednesday but regardless of that we must seize the day.
> > >> While it seems absurd that NNSA could be a possible "master
> developer," we can't be sure that Mayor Webber and the people around him
> wouldn't want that -- or want, say, a training facility for plutonium
> workers. We just don't know.
> > >> This event will also give us a chance for us to network with each
> other and with representatives of any other groups present, as well as
> speak to any City officials willing to do so.
> > >> Getting people to come on Wednesday is the sole action item we are
> recommending right now. It is very, very important!
> > >> Thank you!
> > >> Greg, Trish, Lydia, Ernie, Michelle, and the rest of the Study Group
> > >> --
> > >> Greg Mello
> > >> Los Alamos Study Group
> > >> 2901 Summit Place NE
> > >> Albuquerque, NM 87106
> > >> 505-265-1200 office
> > >> 505-577-8563 cell
> > >> To subscribe to our Friends listserve send a blank email here. To
> unsubscribe send a blank email here.
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> here. To unsubscribe send a blank email here.
> > >> Our blog: Remember your Humanity. Twitter: @TrishABQ. We have shut
> down our Facebook page.
> > >> ---
> > >> To unsubscribe: <mailto:lasg_friends-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net>
> > >> List help: <https://riseup.net/lists>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> America is waking up, as Germany once did, to the awareness that
> > >> 1/3 of your people would kill another 1/3, while 1/3 watches.
> > >> Werner Herzog
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Merle Lefkoff, Ph.D.
> > >> President, Center for Emergent Diplomacy
> > >> emergentdiplomacy.org
> > >> Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
> > >> merlelefkoff at gmail.com
> > >> mobile:  (303) 859-5609
> > >> skype:  merle.lelfkoff2
> > >> twitter: @Merle_Lefkoff
> > >>
> > >>
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