[FRIAM] Islam-Science-Muslims-and-Technology-Seyyed-Hossein-Nasr-in-Conversation-with-Muzaffar-Iqbal-2009.pdf

Sat Sep 25 18:33:16 EDT 2021

You read much faster than I.  I spoke only to the intro, a narrative which described the history of the event and its implications for the participants and others.  No big deal.  Take what can you used and leave the rest on the table.  By the way, those scientific modernizing Turks:  weren’t they the same ones that sponsored the Armenian genocide.  As Hywel used to say, “It’s more complicated than that.”  

n

Nick Thompson

 <mailto:ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com> ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com

 <https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/

From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> On Behalf Of Marcus Daniels
Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2021 6:27 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam at redfish.com>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Islam-Science-Muslims-and-Technology-Seyyed-Hossein-Nasr-in-Conversation-with-Muzaffar-Iqbal-2009.pdf

Read like pages 83-86.  That that tools of astronomy may be inadequate to characterize the cosmos.  (Or maybe that we can never really model it?)  And that from that we can conclude that models of the local physics of our biological machinery may also be inadequate?  Non sequitur.  There’s a Quran thumper in the woodpile. 

From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com <mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com> > On Behalf Of thompnickson2 at gmail.com <mailto:thompnickson2 at gmail.com> 
Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2021 2:19 PM
To: 'The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group' <friam at redfish.com <mailto:friam at redfish.com> >
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Islam-Science-Muslims-and-Technology-Seyyed-Hossein-Nasr-in-Conversation-with-Muzaffar-Iqbal-2009.pdf

Great, Dave, 

What did you see there that had that effect?

n

Nick Thompson

 <mailto:ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com> ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com

 <https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/

From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com <mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com> > On Behalf Of Prof David West
Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2021 4:33 PM
To: friam at redfish.com <mailto:friam at redfish.com> 
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Islam-Science-Muslims-and-Technology-Seyyed-Hossein-Nasr-in-Conversation-with-Muzaffar-Iqbal-2009.pdf

The biggest problem with western science since the enlightenment, is the myth that pure science is morally neutral — that the science, e.g., making an atomic bomb, is totally and absolutely separate from the dropping of said bomb on Hiroshima.

The best morning of my trip to Istanbul was the one spent in the Islamic Museum of Science and Technology. Wonderful exhibits. Strong antidote to the poison of modern scientism.

davew

On Sat, Sep 25, 2021, at 12:16 PM, thompnickson2 at gmail.com <mailto:thompnickson2 at gmail.com>  wrote:

Dear Colleagues, 

Because of an interest some of you expressed in Islamic science, I ran down the text linked below.  It is an entire book, and I have read only the first chapter, but I found that fascinating.  It is a sort of airing of linen concerning the role of science in the modern Islamic world that tracks in  interesting ways the recent American ambivalence about science.   This first chapter is both unsettling and very familiar at the same time. 

http://traditionalhikma.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Islam-Science-Muslims-and-Technology-Seyyed-Hossein-Nasr-in-Conversation-with-Muzaffar-Iqbal-2009.pdf

Ok, just to give you sense of one of the places it leaves me:  If the fault of western science is that it is laced with  unacknowledged western values, what would a science that acknowledged its values look like.  I have argued that the science we practice is absurdly dualistic (given that we have only one source of information).  But it is unclear to me how “dualism” is a value.  Is the “rape of nature” and all that follows implicit in dualism?  I wish I could claim that if I turn you all into monists, you will all become wind=turbine fanatics, but I don’t think that’s the case.   Do values guide what we do or are they just the heavy artillery that we muster to convince others to do what we have done? 

See what you think?

Nick

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