[FRIAM] technical notes on fusion announcement

Gillian Densmore gil.densmore at gmail.com
Fri Dec 16 12:45:57 EST 2022 

frank: ah! thanks. It seems like you've had 99 lives man.

On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at 12:28 AM Marcus Daniels <marcus at snoutfarm.com>
wrote:

> I like the idea of a large transatlantic DC power cable.   That would
> enable solar power to be distributed around the world.   It would reduce
> the need to depend on batteries for wind and solar.   Of course, you raise
> #3, so it would be a target for sabotage like with Nordstream.  It would be
> nice to think there are things just to valuable to destroy, but probably
> there are no such things.
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> on behalf of Sarbajit Roy <
> sroy.mb at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Friday, December 16, 2022 12:01 AM
> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <
> friam at redfish.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] technical notes on fusion announcement
>
> What you are missing includes
> 1) Disposal of long term hazardous nuclear waste.
> 2) Problems in maintaining / decommissioning ol older nuclear
> fission plants
> 3) Examples like we are seeing Ukraine's nuclear plants caught up in a war.
>
> On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at 2:59 AM Gillian Densmore <gil.densmore at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Ok so this is cool and all.
> Sigh I'll ask *that* question. We want less carbons because the planet is
> on f'n fire <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFgBFYkBZ6E>  . As far as I
> know humans (in the very least) accelerated climate change. Ie we made this
> mess clean it up. ok fair so far I'm following.
> So uh why not just start with fission (breeders) ? Why not also put as
> much money into matter/anti matter as well as fusion? We can make minute
> amounts of antimatter in massive collider. I'd think something who's by
> product are xrays gamma and some other stuff with a lot of energy created
> would be a massive honney pot the department of energy would pursue as well.
> I know the answer to fission (sadly) is NIMBY. (yes but it's a lot cleaner
> and safer than oil and coal I say)
> I don't know why we haven't looked at other things as well
> What I'm saying is fusion has been humans icarus wings with it being just
> arround the corner for decades. while matter/anti matter is (sort of) here.
> Fission is here. Want zero carbons? cool! so why not build out a ton of
> reactors we already can do. Or am I missing something?
>
> On Wed, Dec 14, 2022 at 8:31 AM Marcus Daniels <marcus at snoutfarm.com>
> wrote:
>
> How ICF might evolve into a power plant:
>
>   https://firstlightfusion.com/technology/power-plant
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Dec 14, 2022, at 7:16 AM, glen <gepropella at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Excellent! Thanks. I think I'll have to push this topic for another day.
> I've got a few more links from other fora I'll plop here just in case I
> only land back here if/when I pop it off the stack later:
>
>
> https://lasers.llnl.gov/news/magnetized-targets-boost-nif-implosion-performance
>
> https://spie.org/news/nuclear-fusion-nifs-hall-of-mirrors-may-solve-worlds-energy-crisis?SSO=1
>
> https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-power-may-run-fuel-even-gets-started
>
> https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/12/what-enabled-the-big-boost-in-fusion-energy-announced-this-week/
>
> On 12/13/22 16:23, Steve Smith wrote:
>
> I think DT refers simply to the remaining fraction of Deuterium/Tritium
> remaining after the reaction event (-4%) without specific accounting for
> remaining D vs T.
>
> My understanding is that D-T  fusion occurs at a lower temperature than
> D-D but that once fusion commences (starting with D-T), both D-T and D-D
> reactions occurring in similar amounts. In laser-driven ICF (as with NIF) I
> believe the ratio of D/T is nominally 50/50 though it would seem to make
> sense to have a higher T to D ratio but most references I see imply equal
> portions.   An equal number of D-D and D-T reactions would seem to consume
> D more quickly, though as that commences, the D/T ratio would go down,
> making D-T reactions (yet) more likely...   tricky business, no wonder it
> has taken decades to get to this point?
>
> The Wikipedia Entry on ICF is pretty good:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inertial_confinement_fusion
>
> I found several popular science Articles which seem to reinforce my sense
> that this "breakthrough" is not as significant as implied:
>
>
> https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-breakthrough-nif-uh-not-really
>
> Other interesting/relevant links regarding D-T and D-D fusion...
>
>
> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/263507001_Species_separation_and_modification_of_neutron_diagnostics_in_inertial-confinement_fusion/figures?lo=1
>
> https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions <
> https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions>
>
> https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html
> <
> https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html
> >
>
> On 12/13/22 4:36 PM, glen wrote:
>
> That's why I asked. I guess I'll assume DT means both deuterium and
> tritium, not just deuterium. If you were going to track fuel use, you'd
> track the rarer part more closely, right?
>
>
> On 12/13/22 09:22, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>
> DT = deuterium?
>
>
> ---
>
> Frank C. Wimberly
>
> 140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
>
> Santa Fe, NM 87505
>
>
> 505 670-9918
>
> Santa Fe, NM
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 10:21 AM glen <gepropella at gmail.com <mailto:
> gepropella at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>
>     Awesome. Thanks. I'm still trying to catch up with the QC Wormhole
> kerfuffle. Who knew Quanta was so click baity?
>
>
>     What is "DT"?
>
>
>     On 12/13/22 09:02, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>
>      > In case no one wanted to get up at 7:00am to watch DOE
> administrators talk:
>
>      >
>
>      >
>
>      > 1. Controlling the laser in space and time was important for
> maintaining symmetry.  Timing precision of 25e-12 secs and laser spatial
> precision of 5e-12 meter were needed. This was thought to be the main
> explanation for the achievement.
>
>      >
>
>      > 2. 8% more power on the laser this time
>
>      >
>
>      > 3. x-ray tomography is used to find flaws in the capsules.
> Developing software to do the counting.
>
>      >
>
>      > 4. They have ongoing efforts to study the fabrication systems and
> their components (done in Germany) to find idiosyncrasies of each.
>
>      >
>
>      > 5. Laser technology improvements since NIF was built which are 20%
> more efficient.
>
>      >
>
>      > 6. Target cost is from labor, and it takes 7 months each
>
>      >
>
>      > 7. 4% of DT is burned in a shot
>
>      >
>
>      > 8. Machine learning ties together radiation hydrodynamics and
> experimental data.   (It sounded preliminary.)
>
>      >
>
>      > 9. The (successful) capsule had more defects than previous
> experiments.   However, previous experiments did show benefits from capsule
> quality.
>
>      >
>
>      > 10. 15% of experiments are indirect drive of this kind, 15% of
> experiments are other approaches to ignition.  The rest are weapons and
> materials characterization.
>
>      >
>
>      > 11. Anomalous laser directional control were problems in the summer
> runs.   Fixed that.
>
>
>
> --
> ꙮ Mɥǝu ǝlǝdɥɐuʇs ɟᴉƃɥʇ' ʇɥǝ ƃɹɐss snɟɟǝɹs˙ ꙮ
>
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