[FRIAM] Still more faking it till you make it

[Marcus Daniels]

The Arc of the Moral Universe is Long but it Bends Toward Justice.   Meanwhile there is injustice.   The universe will do what it will do.  

-----Original Message-----
From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> On Behalf Of glen
Sent: Thursday, September 8, 2022 7:20 AM
To: friam at redfish.com
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Still more faking it till you make it

Yeah, again you're living in an ideal world. The reality is librarians receive requests from their customers for subscriptions to journals. So librarians might receive requests to subscribe to crap journals (requests made, perhaps, by students or new lecturers that haven't done their homework) and they're going to have to decide whether the journal is crap, assuming they have the budget to work with in the first place.

Just saying "if it's crap, don't buy a subscription" is naive to the point of uselessness. It's like those Nigerian scam emails. They wouldn't keep doing it if the hit rate were zero. And, yeah, you can always claim that 95 year old woman struggling to pay for her cancer treatment *should* get scammed because she's stupid. But, in reality, most people won't make silly claims like that. Those of us who *can* help stop scammers, should help stop scammers.


On 9/8/22 06:57, Marcus Daniels wrote:
> If a journal is crap, don't buy a subscription for it.   Mostly I think there is a lot of publication that doesn't need to occur, and the incentives for that are largely to blame.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> On Behalf Of glen
> Sent: Thursday, September 8, 2022 5:54 AM
> To: friam at redfish.com
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Still more faking it till you make it
> 
> Well, there are analogs to "irate customer generating negative feedback" in polluting the commons. The real difference between the rhetoric in that optimal fraud article and things like AI-generated nonsense publications is the "waterfall" accountability. There's an equivalent waterfall accountability to processing information from ill- or non-curated sources. But it's not measured as well, nor are the costs proportionally born by those involved.
> 
> Marcus' suggestion that all the cost should be (is) born at the edge is pure fantasy. The costs are also born by, e.g. every editor with a shred of integrity, every institution that pays for subscriptions, every researcher hunting for a "good" place to submit their work, etc. More banal examples might be wellness channels on Youtube, places like Goop <https://goop.com/>, or the nutriceutical market(s). A poignant example is the Log4Shell supply chain vulnerability.
> 
> Garbage can be inserted into any branch point in the (pollutable) supply chain. And the costs are born by the entire chain, proportionality depending on whether it's "regulated" by conscious attendees (like the head of Fraud in Business, Inc. or the actuaries at the insurance companies).
> 
> On 9/7/22 20:02, Roger Critchlow wrote:
>> In a similar vein, this article showed up on hackernews last week
>>
>> https://bam.kalzumeus.com/archive/optimal-amount-of-fraud/
>> <https://bam.kalzumeus.com/archive/optimal-amount-of-fraud/>
>>
>> though a fraudulent credit card transaction has an irate customer generating negative feedback, where a badly edited journal merely pollutes the commons.
>>
>> -- rec --
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 7, 2022 at 9:42 PM Marcus Daniels <marcus at snoutfarm.com <mailto:marcus at snoutfarm.com>> wrote:
>>
>>      What is the problem with paper mills?  Cite papers that are important, ignore papers that are not.
>>
>>>      On Sep 7, 2022, at 1:32 PM, glen <gepropella at gmail.com <mailto:gepropella at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>       We need to talk about editors
>>>      
>>> http://deevybee.blogspot.com/2022/09/we-need-to-talk-about-editors.h
>>> t
>>> ml?m=1
>>> <http://deevybee.blogspot.com/2022/09/we-need-to-talk-about-editors.
>>> h
>>> tml?m=1>
>>>
>>>      I know. Ya'll are prolly unsubbing because of all my spam. But until Voldemort bans me, this is the state of the world.
>>>
>>>      What does it say about me that I find this beautiful:
>>>
>>>      "Asthma disease are the scatters, gives that influence the lungs, the organs that let us to inhale and it’s the principal visit disease overall particularly in India. During this work, the matter of lung maladies simply like the trouble experienced while arranging the sickness in radiography are frequently illuminated. There are various procedures found in writing for recognition of asthma infection identification. A few agents have contributed their realities for Asthma illness expectation. The need for distinguishing asthma illness at a beginning period is very fundamental and is an exuberant research territory inside the field of clinical picture preparing. For this, we’ve survey numerous relapse models, k-implies bunching, various leveled calculation, characterizations and profound learning methods to search out best classifier for lung illness identification. These papers generally settlement about winning carcinoma discovery methods that are reachable inside the
>>>      writing."
> 


--
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