<!DOCTYPE html><html><head><title></title><style type="text/css">p.MsoNormal,p.MsoNoSpacing{margin:0}</style></head><body><div style="font-family:Arial;">Gary,<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;">I sent it to your email. If anyone else wants it,I can do the same.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;">davew<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div>On Mon, Nov 25, 2019, at 1:53 PM, Gary Schiltz wrote:<br></div><blockquote type="cite" id="qt"><div dir="ltr">Is your paper available?<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div class="qt-gmail_quote"><div class="qt-gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Mon, Nov 25, 2019 at 7:11 AM Prof David West <<a href="mailto:profwest@fastmail.fm">profwest@fastmail.fm</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote style="margin-top:0px;margin-right:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0.8ex;border-left-color:rgb(204, 204, 204);border-left-style:solid;border-left-width:1px;padding-left:1ex;" class="qt-gmail_quote"><div style="font-family:Arial;">Some comments that might be intrusive (in which case, I apologize and please ignore) or contributory as context to the "ownership" discussion.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> Two-years ago I presented a paper, "Patterns of Humanity," at a social change conference. Part of the paper dealt with "economics," — in. quotation marks because not all of economics, but practical efforts to set up alternative mechanisms for economic exchange.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> All systems of exchange can be derived from three human/cultural patterns of reciprocity: general, balanced, and negative. Simplified: General is akin to parent-child, value is given with little regard for "repayment" except in very general and delayed terms (kids take care of their parents in old age); Balanced is implied by the name, exchange occurs but is balanced among all members of the group - with remarkably precise awareness of any imbalances, (we all know which of us missed their turn to buy a round of drinks when we are out partying); Negative is both sides trying to maximize benefit at the expense of the other party.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> The key factor in viability of each type is social distance; general within family, balanced among small groups, and negative the only one that scales and includes strangers.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> Markets can be based on balanced reciprocity, but only at relative small scale, e.g. the village or a community like the Amish.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> Almost all markets with which we are familiar and within which we participate are grounded in negative reciprocity. Because these are focused on asymmetric outcomes; they are enhanced by asymmetry with regard the factors of the mechanism of exchange. Two of the most common are asymmetry with regards information and asymmetry with regards power.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> A concept of "ownership" is but a tool for establishing or enhancing an asymmetry of power. <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> Like Markets, a "Commons" can be grounded in balanced or negative reciprocity. The possibility of a "balanced" Commons is constrained, by social distance. The only way to ensure the minimal social distance necessary for a balanced Commons is some kind of overriding Culture. So it works just fine in groups with a strong defining culture like the Amish, Mennonites, and pre-statehood Mormon communities.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> Commons derived from negative reciprocity are doomed to "failure."<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> davew<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> On Thu, Nov 21, 2019, at 8:36 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote:<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > Nick writes:<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > < Dogs seem to have (or enact) a concept of ownership. > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > Just have to bite on this one: My cattle dog seems to think of her <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > collar as jewelry. If I take it off she chases after me and tries to <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > get it back. <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > < This scheme is known as altruistic enforcement because from a <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > Darwinian modeling point of view, it's hard to see why the dominant <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > individuals -- the soldiers, if you will -- don't pool their resources <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > and take down the Don. ><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > Each would have to believe the new boss would be better than the old <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > boss, that it wouldn't be them, and that someone will be the boss. <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > They've invested in an organization that has a pecking order, and so it <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > would be dangerous to suddenly abandon it in favor of a looser cabal: <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > Everyone beneath each of them might do the same. <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > Marcus<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > ============================================================<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > to unsubscribe <a rel="noreferrer" href="http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com">http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com</a><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > archives back to 2003: <a rel="noreferrer" href="http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/">http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/</a><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> > FRIAM-COMIC <a rel="noreferrer" href="http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/">http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/</a> by Dr. Strangelove<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> ><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> ============================================================<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> to unsubscribe <a rel="noreferrer" href="http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com">http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com</a><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> archives back to 2003: <a rel="noreferrer" href="http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/FRIAM-COMIC">http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/<br> FRIAM-COMIC</a> <a rel="noreferrer" href="http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/">http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/</a> by Dr. Strangelove</div></blockquote></div><div>============================================================<br></div><div>FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv<br></div><div>Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College<br></div><div>to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com<br></div><div>archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/<br></div><div>FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove<br></div><div><br></div></blockquote><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div></body></html>