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<p class="MsoNormal">https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/05/05/us/coronavirus-death-toll-us.html<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Friam <friam-bounces@redfish.com> on behalf of David Eric Smith <desmith@santafe.edu><br>
<b>Reply-To: </b>The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam@redfish.com><br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, May 6, 2020 at 9:02 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam@redfish.com><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">There was an article on this, I think NYT, I think sometime last week. So some group is currently doing that on some data set. I too would like to see it done more comprehensively and systematically by some group.
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<p class="MsoNormal">Probably I saw the article because somebody posted it to this list. Slap me when I wake back up.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Eric<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On May 7, 2020, at 12:01 PM, Joe Spinden <<a href="mailto:js@qri.us">js@qri.us</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">This endless parsing of the data strikes me as too difficult to accurately assess.<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">A simpler approach might be to compare overall death rates from a comparable period, tentatively attributing at least a large part of the numerical differences to the main changed variable: COVID-19. <span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">On 5/6/20 8:44 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I think that is a little pessimistic. If you look at, say, the UK Biobank, they have interviews with each subject characterizing things like work history, cognitive function, mental health, noise pollution and so on. But they also
have details on mortality and genomic sequences. <span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt">From:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Friam<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:friam-bounces@redfish.com"><friam-bounces@redfish.com></a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>on
behalf of Prof David West<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:profwest@fastmail.fm"><profwest@fastmail.fm></a><br>
<b>Reply-To:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:friam@redfish.com"><friam@redfish.com></a><br>
<b>Date:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Wednesday, May 6, 2020 at 7:40 PM<br>
<b>To:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b><a href="mailto:friam@redfish.com">"friam@redfish.com"</a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:friam@redfish.com"><friam@redfish.com></a><br>
<b>Subject:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">When we have comprehensive data — say a year from now — there will be hundreds of unexplained anomalies. All of the models and all of the formulas will be made more and more complex to try to
account for those anomalies, the epidemiological and statistical equivalent of astronomical epicycles.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">And no one will look at variations in individual and group (10-100 individuals) behavior and how they differ as a "function" of culture. And they will thereby miss the "explanation" for those
anomalies.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">No grocery store in the Utah counties of Kane and Garfield, had had empty toilet paper, flour, or sanitizer shelves. Not fully stocked, absent the usual variety, but never empty. A statistical
/ economic / "scientific" study of these two counties and any other two counties in the US with similar populations and population density/distributions will never reveal the "reason" for this phenomenon. A cultural investigation will expose the "reason" almost
immediately.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">I predict similar anomalies with regard spread of the disease and most importantly variations in death rates among those infected. And, the "reason" will again be cultural/behavioral.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">davew</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Wed, May 6, 2020, at 3:49 PM, <a href="mailto:thompnickson2@gmail.com">thompnickson2@gmail.com</a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Doesn’t doubling time handle that problem? <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">N<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Nicholas Thompson<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Clark University<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:ThompNickSon2@gmail.com"><span style="color:#0563C1">ThompNickSon2@gmail.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/"><span style="color:#0563C1">https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Friam<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:friam-bounces@redfish.com"><friam-bounces@redfish.com></a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf
Of<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Steven A Smith<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>Sent:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, May 6, 2020 2:00 PM<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>To:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:friam@redfish.com">friam@redfish.com</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>Subject:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On 5/6/20 1:54 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">My brother lives in Dahlonega, Lumpkin County, Georgia. The map Georgia map surprises me Atlanta is not a hotspot. Atlanta dominates the population of the State. Southwest Georgia has a much higher concentration. Georgia, unlike Pennsylvania,
has a large population of rural African Americans.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">This just underscores how hard it is to make sense out of absolute numbers, or more to the point, numerators without denominators. At least some of the charts of absolute numbers (as long as they are not renormalized from situation to
situation) provide a visual estimation of "slope".<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 1:43 PM Roger Critchlow <<a href="mailto:rec@elf.org">rec@elf.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hall County is a county located in the north central portion of the U.S. state of Georgia. As of the 2010 census, the population was 179,684. The county seat is Gainesville.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/national/coronavirus-us-cases-deaths/" target="_blank">https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/national/coronavirus-us-cases-deaths/</a> provides maps of deaths and cases per county,
raw numbers and per 100000 population. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- rec --<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 3:18 PM uǝlƃ<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><span class="font"><span style="font-family:"Apple Color Emoji"">☣</span></span><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:gepropella@gmail.com" target="_blank">gepropella@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hall: 20,441<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">DeKalb: 759,297<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On 5/6/20 12:08 PM,<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:thompnickson2@gmail.com" target="_blank">thompnickson2@gmail.com</a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">> Glen, those Hall/King comparisons are pretty dramatic. Go Kemp! What is the population of the two counties? <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">--<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="font"><span style="font-family:"Apple Color Emoji"">☣</span></span><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>uǝlƃ<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">.-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... .... . ...<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">archives:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/" target="_blank">http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">FRIAM-COMIC<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/" target="_blank">http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">--<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Frank Wimberly<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">140 Calle Ojo Feliz<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Santa Fe, NM 87505<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">505 670-9918<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 <span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://bit.ly/virtualfriam">bit.ly/virtualfriam</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">unsubscribe<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com">http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">archives:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/">http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">FRIAM-COMIC<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/">http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">unsubscribe <a href="http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com">http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">archives: <a href="http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/">http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">FRIAM-COMIC <a href="http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/">http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/</a> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<pre>.-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... .... . ...<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 <a href="http://bit.ly/virtualfriam">bit.ly/virtualfriam</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>unsubscribe <a href="http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com">http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>archives: <a href="http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/">http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>FRIAM-COMIC <a href="http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/">http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/</a> <o:p></o:p></pre>
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<pre style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;text-align:start;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span style="font-size:9.0pt">-- <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:9.0pt">Joe<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:9.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:9.0pt">Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail communication and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged information for the use of the designated recipients named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this communication in error and that any review, disclosure, dissemination, distribution, or copying of it or its contents is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify me immediately by replying to this message and deleting it from your computer. Thank you.<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
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FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv<br>
Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 </span><a href="http://bit.ly/virtualfriam"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">bit.ly/virtualfriam</span></a><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica"><br>
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archives:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a href="http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica">http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/</span></a><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica"><br>
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