<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Literally it says “it pleases me” which is the passive voice leading to the question who is “it?"<br class=""><div class="">
<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div class="">_______________________</div><div class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Ed Angel<br class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Founding Director, Art, Research, Technology and Science Laboratory (ARTS Lab)<br class="">Professor Emeritus of Computer Science, University of New Mexico<br class=""><br class="">1017 Sierra Pinon</div><div class="">Santa Fe, NM 87501<br class="">505-984-0136 (home)<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre; "> </span> <span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre; "> </span><a href="mailto:angel@cs.unm.edu" class="">angel@cs.unm.edu</a></div><div class="">505-453-4944 (cell) <span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre; "> </span><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space: pre; "> </span><a href="http://www.cs.unm.edu/~angel" class="">http://www.cs.unm.edu/~angel</a><br class=""></div></span></span>
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<div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Aug 7, 2020, at 4:30 PM, Gary Schiltz <<a href="mailto:gary@naturesvisualarts.com" class="">gary@naturesvisualarts.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">I'm no grammar expert, even in my native English, but I don't believe "me gusta el cafe" is using passive voice. It literally says "coffee pleases me". Comments, Frank? But then, I may be confused about what passive voice is.</div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 5:23 PM Angel Edward <<a href="mailto:edward.angel@gmail.com" class="">edward.angel@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word" class="">Isn’t it a consequence of the routine use of the passive voice in Spanish as in “me gusta” instead of “yo gusto?”<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The passive voice is pretty much gone in textbooks but I occasionally I get objections from Spanish speakers who claim my textbook can’t be serious because I don’t use the passive voice.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Ed<br class=""><div class="">
<div class="">__________<br class=""><br class="">Ed Angel<br class=""><br class="">Founding Director, Art, Research, Technology and Science Laboratory (ARTS Lab)<br class="">Professor Emeritus of Computer Science, University of New Mexico<br class=""><br class="">1017 Sierra Pinon<br class="">Santa Fe, NM 87501<br class="">505-984-0136 (home)<span style="white-space:pre-wrap" class=""> </span> <span style="white-space:pre-wrap" class=""> </span><a href="mailto:edward.angel@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">edward.angel@gmail.com</a><br class="">505-453-4944 (cell) <span style="white-space:pre-wrap" class=""> </span><span style="white-space:pre-wrap" class=""> </span><a href="http://www.cs.unm.edu/~angel" target="_blank" class="">http://www.cs.unm.edu/~angel</a><br class=""></div>
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<div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Aug 7, 2020, at 4:17 PM, Gary Schiltz <<a href="mailto:gary@NaturesVisualArts.com" target="_blank" class="">gary@NaturesVisualArts.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">Despite living in a Spanish speaking country for 12 years, I still struggle mightily with Spanish grammar. This is mainly due to laziness on my part, as well as lack of necessity to immerse myself in the language (there are a lot of English speakers here, not to mention expat groups on Facebook in English). Still, Spanish is *so* much more consistent in all respects than English - pronunciation especially. But the reflexive verbs are still somewhat of a mystery to me. I've wondered exactly the same thing that Frank mentioned: does "the cup fell itself on me" and "the pencil broke itself on mf" represent desire to avoid responsibility? Maybe even blame the victim? Ouch! Your nose nearly broke my fist!</div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 2:06 PM Tom Johnson <<a href="mailto:tom@jtjohnson.com" target="_blank" class="">tom@jtjohnson.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr" class="">Or the equally famous Spanish phrase, "The pencil broke itself." A phrase which you think I would remember.<div class="">TJ<br clear="all" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class=""><br class="">============================================<br class="">Tom Johnson - <a href="mailto:tom@jtjohnson.com" target="_blank" class="">tom@jtjohnson.com</a><br class="">Institute for Analytic Journalism -- Santa Fe, NM USA<br class="">505.577.6482(c) 505.473.9646(h)<br class=""><a href="http://nmfog.org/" target="_blank" class=""><b class=""><font color="#0b5394" class="">NM Foundation for Open Government</font></b></a><br class=""><b class=""><font color="#0000ff" class="">Check out <a href="https://www.facebook.com/pages/Its-The-Peoples-Data/1599854626919671" target="_blank" class="">It's The People's Data</a></font></b> </div><div class="">============================================</div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br class=""></div></div><div id="gmail-m_-908132491841530739gmail-m_2696335186146636138DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2" class=""><br class="">
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</tbody></table><a width="1" height="1" class=""></a></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 12:55 PM Frank Wimberly <<a href="mailto:wimberly3@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">wimberly3@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto" class="">In Spanish if you drop your cup you say, "See me cayó la taza". A literal word--for-word translation is "The cup fell itself on me". Some people say this is an effort to avoid responsibility.<div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">Frank<br class=""><br class=""><div dir="auto" class="">---<br class="">Frank C. Wimberly<br class="">140 Calle Ojo Feliz, <br class="">Santa Fe, NM 87505<br class=""><br class="">505 670-9918<br class="">Santa Fe, NM</div></div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Aug 7, 2020, 9:01 AM Barry MacKichan <<a href="mailto:barry.mackichan@mackichan.com" target="_blank" class="">barry.mackichan@mackichan.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><u class=""></u>
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<div style="font-family:sans-serif" class=""><div style="white-space:normal" class=""><p dir="auto" class="">Very much so. We hired a grad student a long time ago (he stayed with us until he retired). He wrote great Pascal programs. He wrote great Pascal programs in C++, and in JavaScript. The effect of your first programming language on style, idioms, and your feelings about recursion and encapsulation.</p><p dir="auto" class="">—Barry</p><p dir="auto" class="">On 6 Aug 2020, at 23:24, <a href="mailto:thompnickson2@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">thompnickson2@gmail.com</a> wrote:</p>
<blockquote style="border-left:2px solid rgb(119,119,119);color:rgb(119,119,119);margin:0px 0px 5px;padding-left:5px" class=""><p dir="auto" class="">Nah. He means more than that. Even ordinary languages predispose users to one kind of discourse or another. I assume that programming languages do the same. <br class="">
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N</p>
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