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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap:break-word'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal>EricS, <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>I hope I am not the metaphor Nazi; I certainly don\u2019t want to be him. I certainly don\u2019t want to execute anybody for using metaphors. On the contrary. Rather my point is that they are essential to good thought and that many scientists who voice contempt for metaphors use them regularly all the time in ways that are essential to their work. The Pragmatic value of recognizing that we are using metaphors is that such a recognition leads to a discussion of whether we are using them well. All metaphors, be it good ones or bad ones, import \u201csurplus meaning\u201d into the terms of use, and this surplus meaning can affect scientific thinking for good or ill depending on whether we acknowledge it and systematically explore its implications. Surplus meaning is often the wet edge of discovery but some times the hidden assumption that keeps us from seeing the plain facts before us. The clearest example of this is the metaphor of natural selection in which Darwin imagined that nature is like a giant pigeon coop. This metaphor contain contains an infinity of useful implications and a few that are down right poisonous. It\u2019s important to know which are which. I think Frank\u2019s example of gravity is perhaps another great example. Isn\u2019t it one of Einstein\u2019s greatest insights that the metaphor of attraction implicit in \u201cgravity\u201d, which arose from experiments with primitive magnets in Newton\u2019s time, is not as useful in many instances as the metaphor that massive objects warp the space around them. So, one of Einstein\u2019s great contributions to physics is that he introduced a new metaphor? Do I have that wrong?<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Do regard your affection for poetry as a sinful indulgence or do you regard it (as I would) as an essential feature of your scientific imagination. <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>I don\u2019t know why it is that moving house seems to free me up to think about everything but moving house. One is not allowed parting shots in parliamentary debate, and I probably shouldn\u2019t be taking them here. <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Nick <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Nick Thompson<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><a href="mailto:ThompNickSon2@gmail.com"><span style='color:#0563C1'>ThompNickSon2@gmail.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><a href="https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/"><span style='color:#0563C1'>https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/</span></a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b>From:</b> Friam <friam-bounces@redfish.com> <b>On Behalf Of </b>David Eric Smith<br><b>Sent:</b> Saturday, May 8, 2021 9:13 PM<br><b>To:</b> The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam@redfish.com><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [FRIAM] Morphogenisis<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>English has two categories of verbs: intransitive and transitive.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>If you use an intransitive verb \u2014 \u201cyet it moves\u201d \u2014 the Metaphor Nazi will catch you coming: claiming you are representing volition.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>If you use a transitive verb \u2014 \u201cit is moved by gravity\u201d \u2014 the Metaphor Nazi will catch you going: claiming an agent/patient relation, where the agent is probably (metaphorically) God (!), or whatever God is a metaphor for. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>And we have from Ecclesiastes (the verse in praise of the Metaphor Nazi):<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><a href="http://www.shakespeare-online.com/sonnets/59.html#:~:text=If there be nothing new (1): Compare Ecclesiastes 1.9,new thing under the sun."">http://www.shakespeare-online.com/sonnets/59.html#:~:text=If%20there%20be%20nothing%20new%20(1)%3A%20Compare%20Ecclesiastes%201.9,new%20thing%20under%20the%20sun.%22</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>Ecclesiastes 1.9: "The thing that hath been is that which shall be; and that which hath been done is that which shall be done; and there is no new thing under the sun."</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>To which the scientist (note small \u201cs\u201d) would like to assert \u201cthe language of mechanics is not English; speaking it is a new practice available to people to participate in\u201d.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>But let Shakespeare have the last word:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>If there be nothing new, but that which is<br>Hath been before, how are our brains beguil'd,<br>Which, labouring for invention, bear amiss<br>The second burthen of a former child!<br>O, that record could with a backward look,<br>Even of five hundred courses of the sun,<br>Show me your image in some antique book,<br>Since mind at first in character was done!<br>That I might see what the old world could say<br>To this composed wonder of your frame;<br>Whether we are mended, or whe'r better they,<br>Or whether revolution be the same.<br>O! sure I am, the wits of former days<br>To subjects worse have given admiring praise.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><br><br></span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>Eric</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><br><br></span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>On May 9, 2021, at 11:36 AM, Prof David West <<a href="mailto:profwest@fastmail.fm">profwest@fastmail.fm</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>The ball accelerated is clearly a metaphor as it implies that the ball is doing a specific thing, that the ball has behavior and probably volition. This is clearly not what you literally mean.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>davew<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>On Sat, May 8, 2021, at 4:57 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px' id=qt><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>"The ball accelerated at approximately 32 feet per second squared at sea level in a vacuum."<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>doesn't seem to be a metaphor to me.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>---<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Frank C. Wimberly<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>140 Calle Ojo Feliz,<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Santa Fe, NM 87505<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>505 670-9918<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Santa Fe, NM<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>On Sat, May 8, 2021, 3:07 PM <<a href="mailto:thompnickson2@gmail.com">thompnickson2@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Listen, Fella!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>It\u2019s metaphors all the way down!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>[shoe thrown]<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>n<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Nick Thompson<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><a href="mailto:ThompNickSon2@gmail.com" target="_blank"><span style='color:#0563C1'>ThompNickSon2@gmail.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><a href="https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwordpress.clarku.edu%2fnthompson%2f&c=E,1,76cwsDofsJZfToBxaQU6zR5cllp_k59wtln_iQtSrD8ozjyEN9kt0FPUs4RnuGnWMKFW-nOw3wJjMgAgCJAkSTlh3C3YKbI75yNyUMUvvw,,&typo=1" target="_blank"><span style='color:#0563C1'>https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;border-color:currentcolor currentcolor;border-image-outset: 0;border-image-repeat: stretch;border-image-slice: 100%;border-image-source: none;border-image-width: 1'><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>From:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> </span></span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Friam <<a href="mailto:friam-bounces@redfish.com" target="_blank">friam-bounces@redfish.com</a>><span class=apple-converted-space> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></b>Gary Schiltz<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Sent:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> </span></span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Saturday, May 8, 2021 1:36 PM<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>To:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> </span></span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <<a href="mailto:friam@redfish.com" target="_blank">friam@redfish.com</a>><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Subject:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> </span></span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Re: [FRIAM] Morphogenisis<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>First of all, it's just a metaphor (ducking, the shoe barely missing my head) :-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Second of all, that description of animal development sure sounds to me like "following a script". <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>On Sat, May 8, 2021 at 2:23 PM <<a href="mailto:thompnickson2@gmail.com" target="_blank">thompnickson2@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rgb(204, 204, 204);border-image-outset: 0;border-image-repeat: stretch;border-image-slice: 100%;border-image-source: none;border-image-width: 1'><div><div><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>This struck me:<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-m-7272196601106796176gmail-m-6118501720637267473quotation><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>When animals develop, they don\u2019t follow a script. Instead, responding to their environment, the cells negotiate and feel their way toward a final form. A fertilized egg divides, and divides again, creating a hollow ball of cells called a blastula; genes instruct these cells to release chemicals, and other cells, reacting to those chemical concentrations, decide to migrate elsewhere or to develop into specific types of tissue. Other influences\u2014oxygen, nutrients, hormones, sometimes toxins\u2014further shape gestation.<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><a href="https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/05/10/persuading-the-body-to-regenerate-its-limbs?utm_source=nl&utm_brand=tny&utm_mailing=TNY_Daily_050821&utm_campaign=aud-dev&utm_medium=email&bxid=5bd678d924c17c104801f684&cndid=40835928&hasha=1dc6f15a30be2d4712fae5f0e5a9a679&hashb=5e4befc88214fadc869224d7cb34d55f51451bc7&hashc=0c6ef6b7bc8221288e1f4a4ca0116d78a21ebdbe47949488640c7c54c93120fb&esrc=AUTO_PRINT&utm_term=TNY_Daily" target="_blank">https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/05/10/persuading-the-body-to-regenerate-its-limbs?utm_source=nl&utm_brand=tny&utm_mailing=TNY_Daily_050821&utm_campaign=aud-dev&utm_medium=email&bxid=5bd678d924c17c104801f684&cndid=40835928&hasha=1dc6f15a30be2d4712fae5f0e5a9a679&hashb=5e4befc88214fadc869224d7cb34d55f51451bc7&hashc=0c6ef6b7bc8221288e1f4a4ca0116d78a21ebdbe47949488640c7c54c93120fb&esrc=AUTO_PRINT&utm_term=TNY_Daily</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>First, note the reliance on psychological terms. This is the sort of passage that would stimulate my teasing Hywel with, \u201cSo you see, Hywel, psychology really IS the mother of all sciences.\u201d And don\u2019t any of you DARE to come back at me with, \u201cIt\u2019s just a metaphor.\u201d <span class=apple-converted-space> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Second, which of these two models encapsulates more closely what you wizards mean by computation. Is carrying out an algorithm more like \u201ccomputation\u201d or is \u201cbuilding a limb\u201d? Is a salamander\u2019s limb \u201ccomputed\u201d? If so, who computes it, or is that a violation of the language of computation. I know. Fools rush in where wise men fear to tread.<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Your loyal fool,<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Nic<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Nick Thompson<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><a href="mailto:ThompNickSon2@gmail.com" target="_blank">ThompNickSon2@gmail.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=qt-msonormal><span 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