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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/16/22 10:56 AM, cody dooderson
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAEddvG32fC6NPAM4FOtS19vOXfS0GOqucWe2EnRP7HHak05_Qw@mail.gmail.com">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<div dir="auto">I had never heard of a transatlantic power grid.
That is an interesting idea. The sun is probably shining
somewhere on the earth at any given time. Would a lot of energy
get wasted with the long distances? <br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Nikola Tesla is rolling in his magnetically shielded grave
hearing all this wasteful and under-inspired talk of <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://theconversation.com/nikola-tesla-5g-network-could-realise-his-dream-of-wireless-electricity-a-century-after-experiments-failed-158665#:~:text=He%20theorised%20that%20electricity%20could,electricity%20supply%20were%20never%20realised.">long-range
power transmission</a> via wires?<br>
</p>
<p>my SF addled brain conjures a <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.tntdrama.com/snowpiercer">snow-piercer</a>
style earth-circumscribing rail-line... the pylons can be driven
so deep into the earth's crust that they are tapped into the
earth's inner heat, the rails can be the DC conduit Marcus
suggests. There can be as many windmills and tidal turbines
placed along the line as one feels they
need/can-afford/stand-to-see as well as a PV/thermo solar
continuous collector/shade-roof which can also enhance gradient by
radiating into the (<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/153839/what-is-the-temperature-of-the-clear-night-sky-from-the-surface-of-earth">2.73-273
deg K</a>) sky at night. The Snowpiercer rail-cars can move
(make them pneumatic or evacuated-ballistic (~18mi/sec?)) physical
goods and materials continuously... (thank you Elon Musk).
Mount a few <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.spinlaunch.com/">Spinlaunch</a> units on train
units and squirt things into orbit at-will?<br>
</p>
<p>Wait, maybe it can become a strip-city modeled on <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Line,_Saudi_Arabia">SA's
"Line"</a>... at 100 miles long and 9million population, the
circumferential "line" would be 240 times as long and have a
carrying capacity of >2 Billion based on their predicted
precedent. Place three of these orthogonal to one another like
an <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armillary_sphere">armillary
sphere</a> and we are up to 6B? A modest bump in scale (cube
root of 1.5) could accommodate 9B! A few of us (DaveW, GaryS,
... myself) rebellious non-urban renegades could live in the
remaining landscape NOT covered by these 3 circumscribing strip
cities and live our lives in the spirit of Sean Connery's
character Zed in <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070948/">Zardoz</a>!<br>
</p>
<p>Heck, just a nice precursor to <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.popularmechanics.com/space/deep-space/a11183/could-we-build-a-ringworld-17166651/">Larry
Niven's Ringworld</a> tell Musk he can keep his claims to
Mars... at least until the rest of us need the mass to integrate
into a proper <a
href="https://www.popularmechanics.com/space/deep-space/a11098/dyson-sphere/">Dyson
Sphere</a>...</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAEddvG32fC6NPAM4FOtS19vOXfS0GOqucWe2EnRP7HHak05_Qw@mail.gmail.com"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Dec 16, 2022, 10:46 AM
Gillian Densmore <<a href="mailto:gil.densmore@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">gil.densmore@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">frank: ah! thanks. It seems like you've had 99
lives man.<br>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at
12:28 AM Marcus Daniels <<a
href="mailto:marcus@snoutfarm.com" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">marcus@snoutfarm.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div><span
style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">I
like the idea of a large transatlantic DC power
cable. That would enable solar power to be
distributed around the world. It would reduce
the need to depend on batteries for wind and
solar. Of course, you raise #3, so it would be a
target for sabotage like with Nordstream. It
would be nice to think there are things just to
valuable to destroy, but probably there are no
such things.</span></div>
<hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%">
<div
id="m_-2301734486870571381m_8721844790296258388divRplyFwdMsg"
dir="ltr"><font style="font-size:11pt"
face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000"><b>From:</b>
Friam <<a
href="mailto:friam-bounces@redfish.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">friam-bounces@redfish.com</a>>
on behalf of Sarbajit Roy <<a
href="mailto:sroy.mb@gmail.com" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">sroy.mb@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, December 16, 2022 12:01 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> The Friday Morning Applied Complexity
Coffee Group <<a
href="mailto:friam@redfish.com" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">friam@redfish.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [FRIAM] technical notes on
fusion announcement</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">What
you are missing includes
<br>
1) Disposal of long term hazardous nuclear
waste.<br>
2) Problems in maintaining / decommissioning ol
older nuclear fission plants<br>
3) Examples like we are seeing Ukraine's nuclear
plants caught up in a war.</div>
</div>
<br>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at 2:59 AM
Gillian Densmore <<a
href="mailto:gil.densmore@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">gil.densmore@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Ok so this is cool and all. <br>
</div>
<div>Sigh I'll ask <i>that</i> question. We
want less carbons because <a
href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFgBFYkBZ6E"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">the planet is on
f'n fire</a> . As far as I know humans
(in the very least) accelerated climate
change. Ie we made this mess clean it up. ok
fair so far I'm following.</div>
<div>So uh why not just start with fission
(breeders) ? Why not also put as much money
into matter/anti matter as well as fusion?
We can make minute amounts of antimatter in
massive collider. I'd think something who's
by product are xrays gamma and some other
stuff with a lot of energy created would be
a massive honney pot the department of
energy would pursue as well.</div>
<div>I know the answer to fission (sadly) is
NIMBY. (yes but it's a lot cleaner and safer
than oil and coal I say)
<br>
</div>
<div>I don't know why we haven't looked at
other things as well</div>
<div>What I'm saying is fusion has been humans
icarus wings with it being just arround the
corner for decades. while matter/anti matter
is (sort of) here. Fission is here. Want
zero carbons? cool! so why not build out a
ton of reactors we already can do. Or am I
missing something?<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">On Wed, Dec 14, 2022 at 8:31 AM
Marcus Daniels <<a
href="mailto:marcus@snoutfarm.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">marcus@snoutfarm.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto">How ICF might evolve into a
power plant:
<div><br>
</div>
<div> <a
href="https://firstlightfusion.com/technology/power-plant"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://firstlightfusion.com/technology/power-plant</a><br>
<br>
<div dir="ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
<blockquote type="cite">On Dec 14,
2022, at 7:16 AM, glen <<a
href="mailto:gepropella@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">gepropella@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr"><span>Excellent!
Thanks. I think I'll have to push
this topic for another day. I've
got a few more links from other
fora I'll plop here just in case I
only land back here if/when I pop
it off the stack later:</span><br>
<span></span><br>
<span><a
href="https://lasers.llnl.gov/news/magnetized-targets-boost-nif-implosion-performance"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://lasers.llnl.gov/news/magnetized-targets-boost-nif-implosion-performance</a></span><br>
<span><a
href="https://spie.org/news/nuclear-fusion-nifs-hall-of-mirrors-may-solve-worlds-energy-crisis?SSO=1"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://spie.org/news/nuclear-fusion-nifs-hall-of-mirrors-may-solve-worlds-energy-crisis?SSO=1</a></span><br>
<span><a
href="https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-power-may-run-fuel-even-gets-started"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-power-may-run-fuel-even-gets-started</a></span><br>
<span><a
href="https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/12/what-enabled-the-big-boost-in-fusion-energy-announced-this-week/"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/12/what-enabled-the-big-boost-in-fusion-energy-announced-this-week/</a></span><br>
<span></span><br>
<span>On 12/13/22 16:23, Steve Smith
wrote:</span><br>
<blockquote type="cite"><span>I
think DT refers simply to the
remaining fraction of
Deuterium/Tritium remaining
after the reaction event (-4%)
without specific accounting for
remaining D vs T.</span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span>My
understanding is that D-T
fusion occurs at a lower
temperature than D-D but that
once fusion commences (starting
with D-T), both D-T and D-D
reactions occurring in similar
amounts. In laser-driven ICF (as
with NIF) I believe the ratio of
D/T is nominally 50/50 though it
would seem to make sense to have
a higher T to D ratio but most
references I see imply equal
portions. An equal number of
D-D and D-T reactions would seem
to consume D more quickly,
though as that commences, the
D/T ratio would go down, making
D-T reactions (yet) more
likely... tricky business, no
wonder it has taken decades to
get to this point?</span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span>The
Wikipedia Entry on ICF is pretty
good: <a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inertial_confinement_fusion"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inertial_confinement_fusion</a></span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span>I
found several popular science
Articles which seem to reinforce
my sense that this
"breakthrough" is not as
significant as implied:</span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span> <a
href="https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-breakthrough-nif-uh-not-really"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-breakthrough-nif-uh-not-really</a></span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span>Other
interesting/relevant links
regarding D-T and D-D fusion...</span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span><a
href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/263507001_Species_separation_and_modification_of_neutron_diagnostics_in_inertial-confinement_fusion/figures?lo=1"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.researchgate.net/publication/263507001_Species_separation_and_modification_of_neutron_diagnostics_in_inertial-confinement_fusion/figures?lo=1</a></span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span><a
href="https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions</a>
<<a
href="https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions</a>></span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span><a
href="https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html</a>
<<a
href="https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html</a>></span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><span>On
12/13/22 4:36 PM, glen wrote:</span><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>That's
why I asked. I guess I'll
assume DT means both deuterium
and tritium, not just
deuterium. If you were going
to track fuel use, you'd track
the rarer part more closely,
right?</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>On
12/13/22 09:22, Frank Wimberly
wrote:</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>DT
= deuterium?</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>---</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>Frank
C. Wimberly</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>140
Calle Ojo Feliz,</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>Santa
Fe, NM 87505</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>505
670-9918</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>Santa
Fe, NM</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>On
Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 10:21 AM
glen <<a
href="mailto:gepropella@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">gepropella@gmail.com</a>
<mailto:<a
href="mailto:gepropella@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">gepropella@gmail.com</a>>>
wrote:</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
Awesome. Thanks. I'm still
trying to catch up with the
QC Wormhole kerfuffle. Who
knew Quanta was so click
baity?</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
What is "DT"?</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
On 12/13/22 09:02, Marcus
Daniels wrote:</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> In case no one wanted
to get up at 7:00am to watch
DOE administrators talk:</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 1. Controlling the
laser in space and time was
important for maintaining
symmetry. Timing precision
of 25e-12 secs and laser
spatial precision of 5e-12
meter were needed. This was
thought to be the main
explanation for the
achievement.</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 2. 8% more power on the
laser this time</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 3. x-ray tomography is
used to find flaws in the
capsules. Developing
software to do the counting.</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 4. They have ongoing
efforts to study the
fabrication systems and
their components (done in
Germany) to find
idiosyncrasies of each.</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 5. Laser technology
improvements since NIF was
built which are 20% more
efficient.</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 6. Target cost is from
labor, and it takes 7 months
each</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 7. 4% of DT is burned
in a shot</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 8. Machine learning
ties together radiation
hydrodynamics and
experimental data. (It
sounded preliminary.)</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 9. The (successful)
capsule had more defects
than previous experiments.
However, previous
experiments did show
benefits from capsule
quality.</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 10. 15% of experiments
are indirect drive of this
kind, 15% of experiments are
other approaches to
ignition. The rest are
weapons and materials
characterization.</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
></span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite"><span>
> 11. Anomalous laser
directional control were
problems in the summer
runs. Fixed that.</span><br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<span></span><br>
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<span>ꙮ Mɥǝu ǝlǝdɥɐuʇs ɟᴉƃɥʇ' ʇɥǝ
ƃɹɐss snɟɟǝɹs˙ ꙮ</span><br>
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