<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">A bit outdated<br><br>In 2024, India has 57% from fossil fuels and 43% from renewable sources. <br>Coal usage is 49% in India compared to 61% for China (as per Statista) <br>FYI: The USA has 60% electricity generation from fossil fuels.<br><br><a href="https://powermin.gov.in/en/content/power-sector-glance-all-india">https://powermin.gov.in/en/content/power-sector-glance-all-india</a><br><br><a href="https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php">https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php</a><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Feb 14, 2024 at 2:23\u202fAM Marcus Daniels <<a href="mailto:marcus@snoutfarm.com">marcus@snoutfarm.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class="msg4079463556826858388">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt">Not great! <br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> Friam <<a href="mailto:friam-bounces@redfish.com" target="_blank">friam-bounces@redfish.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Sarbajit Roy<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, February 13, 2024 11:13 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <<a href="mailto:friam@redfish.com" target="_blank">friam@redfish.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [FRIAM] Some brands of digital electric meters wildly inaccurate on nonlinear loads, and NM may get them soon!<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">All households in Delhi get 200 free units per month per meter, and the next 200 units at 50%.<br>
We have 2 meters (1 for lighting and 1 for power), so 400 free units and 400 more at half price.<br>
This winter was a bit colder than usual so I exceeded the free allowance in December on my power meter. and had to pay $15.<br>
It also helps that our Govt was pragmatic and kept buying cheap oil from Russia.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 11:51<span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">\u202f</span>PM Gary Schiltz <<a href="mailto:gary@naturesvisualarts.com" target="_blank">gary@naturesvisualarts.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Must be heavily subsidized?<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 10:03<span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">\u202f</span>AM Sarbajit Roy <<a href="mailto:sroy.mb@gmail.com" target="_blank">sroy.mb@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Sorry, a correction. I paid US$ 15 (not 150) for consuming 3,600 units.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<br>
Sarbajit Roy<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 8:31<span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">\u202f</span>PM Sarbajit Roy <<a href="mailto:sroy.mb@gmail.com" target="_blank">sroy.mb@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Hi Bruno<br>
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Smart meters were mandated in New Delhi India in 2008 onwards and we had the same sort of consumer experience with bills shooting up due to these then "made in China" meters and there was tremendous consumer anger.
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<br>
2 important changes were made for domestic consumers - a) Billing would be on the basis of Kw-hr (resistive) and not on the basis of KVA-hr (reactive). and b) The neutral wiring and meter connection would be through a bus-bar system only (no looping of neutrals)
and ELCBs were made mandatory for preventing earth leakages. That greatly sorted out the problem.
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I believe the meter design was also changed to ensure that the Hall sensors were inserted into the phase as well as neutral lines.<br>
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Here are some links.<br>
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<a href="https://www.derc.gov.in/sites/default/files/Public%20bulletin-5.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.derc.gov.in/sites/default/files/Public%20bulletin-5.pdf</a><br>
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<a href="https://www.derc.gov.in/sites/default/files/TechnicalspecificationforMeters_0.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.derc.gov.in/sites/default/files/TechnicalspecificationforMeters_0.pdf</a><br>
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<a href="https://www.derc.gov.in/sites/default/files/Draft-Regulations.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.derc.gov.in/sites/default/files/Draft-Regulations.pdf</a><br>
(for Page 16 of 80)<br>
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Just for your information, In the past 1 year I have paid a grand total of about US$ 150 in electricity bills for an annual consumption of about 3,600 Kw-Hr (3,600 units).<br>
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Sarbajit Roy<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Feb 13, 2024 at 10:02<span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">\u202f</span>AM _ Bruno W <<a href="mailto:wbruno@gmail.com" target="_blank">wbruno@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">I'm hoping some Friam member who knows a little about how an electric meter works will be interested<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">enough to get this addressed BEFORE PNM spends $ 300+ million giving us all new meters.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">If interested I can send the full paper abstracted here: <a href="https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/8077940" target="_blank">https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/8077940</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">There is also a thesis from the same group that gives more info....<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">The paper makes clear that one of the preferred technologies in electric meters (the Rogowski coil)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">can go haywire when nonlinear loads are present. The smart meters gave readings up to 500% higher<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">than the actual usage. The meters PNM has proposed for its entire territory is the Itron "Gen5" Riva,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">which has been deployed in the last 2 years in Denver and parts of Texas. Sure enough, some customers'<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">bill have gone way up (3 or 4-fold in one news report), and they have little recourse: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpOhTXV59pI&t=20s" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpOhTXV59pI&t=20s</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">I intervened in this PRC proceeding last year, and may be able to get this info onto the record, and try to<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">get the PRC to require better testing on nonlinear loads. But I need someone with some relevant expertise <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">(can be education or experience) to explain the published findings and their implications to the PRC in an affidavit by March.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">This person would then answer questions from the PRC and possibly PNM via zoom in a short hearing in late April or May.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">I have several reasons for not wanting to see PNM make this huge investment (and by law they are entitled to a nice<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">rate of return paid by us, the customers) in a very messed-up technology. Probably most of us in this group<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">don't sweat much about our electric bills (actually maybe if ours quadrupled, we would), but for low-income families, this is
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">potentially very cruel, since the cost of the meters will be charged with interest regardless of usage, and energy-saving<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">appliances typically have nonlinear load usages).<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">I hope to be at the St. John's gathering Friday am, but feel free to reply or contact me directly if interested in this.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">--William J. Bruno<span class="m_4079463556826858388gmaildefault"><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif">, Ph.D.</span></span><span style="font-family:Georgia,serif"><br>
<span class="m_4079463556826858388gmaildefault"><a href="mailto:wbruno@gmail.com" target="_blank">wbruno@gmail.com</a></span></span><u></u><u></u></p>
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