<div dir="auto"><div>By the way, my daughter's title in the Secretary of Public Education Office is Financial Technician. I can multiply two 2 digit numbers mentally pretty fast. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Frank</div><div><br></div><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">---<br>Frank C. Wimberly<br>140 Calle Ojo Feliz, <br>Santa Fe, NM 87505<br><br>505 670-9918<br>Santa Fe, NM</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Aug 8, 2024, 7:11 AM Edward Angel <<a href="mailto:angel@cs.unm.edu">angel@cs.unm.edu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="line-break:after-white-space"><div>The following is hard to believe but true.</div><div><br></div>Last weekend, I was in line at Walgreens. The older woman in front of me gave the cashier a $20 bill for a $13.54 purchase. The young cashier was completely unable to figure out the correct change. After a couple of failed tries, the older woman tried to teach the cashier how to subtract $13.54 from $20 but that was a failure. She then tried to get the casher to add to $13.54 until the cashier reach $20. When that failed, she helped the cashier add small change and dollars until she got to $6.46.<div><br></div><div>I don’t think giving everyone a calculator is the solution.</div><div><br></div><div>Ed<br id="m_8634951496365189856lineBreakAtBeginningOfMessage"><div>
<span style="border-collapse:separate;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:-webkit-auto;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span style="border-collapse:separate;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:-webkit-auto;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div>_______________________</div><div><br>Ed Angel<br><br></div><div>Founding Director, Art, Research, Technology and Science Laboratory (ARTS Lab)<br>Professor Emeritus of Computer Science, University of <a href="https://www.google.com/maps/search/New+Mexico+1017+Sierra+Pinon+Santa+Fe,+NM+87501?entry=gmail&source=g">New Mexico</a><br><br><a href="https://www.google.com/maps/search/New+Mexico+1017+Sierra+Pinon+Santa+Fe,+NM+87501?entry=gmail&source=g">1017 Sierra Pinon</a></div><div><a href="https://www.google.com/maps/search/New+Mexico+1017+Sierra+Pinon+Santa+Fe,+NM+87501?entry=gmail&source=g">Santa Fe, NM 87501</a><br>505-984-0136 (home)<span style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span> <span style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span><a href="mailto:angel@cs.unm.edu" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">angel@cs.unm.edu</a></div><div>505-453-4944 (cell) <span style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span><span style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span><a href="http://www.cs.unm.edu/~angel" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">http://www.cs.unm.edu/~angel</a><br></div></span></span>
</div>
<div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Aug 7, 2024, at 9:28 PM, Frank Wimberly <<a href="mailto:wimberly3@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">wimberly3@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br><div><div dir="auto"><div>I'm not sure my 30+ year old daughter knows the times tables. She works for the Secretary of Public Education. If you ask her about it she will say she uses calculators and spreadsheets. I think.</div><div><br></div><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">---<br>Frank C. Wimberly<br><a href="https://www.google.com/maps/search/140+Calle+Ojo+Feliz,++Santa+Fe,+NM+87505?entry=gmail&source=g">140 Calle Ojo Feliz, </a><br><a href="https://www.google.com/maps/search/140+Calle+Ojo+Feliz,++Santa+Fe,+NM+87505?entry=gmail&source=g">Santa Fe, NM 87505</a><br><br>505 670-9918<br>Santa Fe, NM</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Aug 7, 2024, 9:12 PM Russell Standish <<a href="mailto:lists@hpcoders.com.au" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">lists@hpcoders.com.au</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">It is a test that you know your 7 or 8 times table. And the definition<br>
of a prime number (which could be given as part of the question, if<br>
not the curriculum).<br>
<br>
I would expect most 9 or 10 years olds should know their times tables.<br>
<br>
Or am I wrong abut kids these days?<br>
<br>
On Mon, Jul 22, 2024 at 12:43:54PM -0600, Tom Johnson wrote:<br>
> Ms. O'Hara:<br>
> <br>
> RE your story Sunday, "Does proficiency give full picture?"<br>
> From your lede:<br>
> "Pop quiz: What number is both a prime number and a factor or 56"?<br>
> <br>
> If I understand correctly, this is a question on an exam given to fourth<br>
> graders, 9- or 10-year-olds.<br>
> Could you please point me to some source in the city or state education<br>
> departments who can tell me what short- or long-term value this question about<br>
> mathematics -- NOT arithmetic -- has for students that age?<br>
> <br>
> We live in a state where it is a rare cashier who can do the mental<br>
> arithmetic to make change from a $20 bill. Can we first find out if fourth<br>
> graders can do that before getting into primes and factorials?<br>
> *--<br>
> ============================================<br>
> Tom Johnson - <a href="mailto:tom@jtjohnson.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">tom@jtjohnson.com</a><br>
> Institute for Analytic Journalism -- Santa Fe, NM USA<br>
> 505.577.6482(c) 505.473.9646(h)<br>
> Visit Global Santa Fe<br>
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