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cite="mid:CAA5dAfo5Ytd9GQriF7iWTEw3_QjQ0KD+-wNfjLfzxPM_HZF-WQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div>Wasn't a paper linked to here that said that the only
solution to the existential problem of climate change is to
reduce the population of the earth to 1 billion from 8
billion?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote> </blockquote>
"OK team, count off: <i>1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, </i><font size="6"><b><i>8</i>
!</b></font>"
<blockquote> <br>
"everyone whose number is a prime not in the <i>Fibonacci
sequence</i> step forward ... you get to live. Those who
don't know which you are stay firm, doctor Kavorkian's troops will
be around to see you in a moment with the others."<br>
</blockquote>
<p>I personally kind of like the "Downsizing" (2017 Matt Damon)
alternative. At 5" tall and cube-root scaling of volume/mass our
consumption would go down by roughly 3 orders of magnitude...
We'd be more like a plague of locusts as we go back to an R0 of
order 1.02 with a doubling factor of 33 years. 16/32 bn
oversized locusts with "godlike technology" by the end of the
century? For you doubters, there are dozens of literary or
popular fiction references so it *must* be true? (Gulliver, Babes
in Toyland, Fantastic Voyage, Honey I Shrunk the Kids!, et cet.)
<br>
</p>
<p>Mary and I have four grandchildren between us... we agree that if
we want any of them to reproduce we should probably step aside
gracefully ourselves no matter what Kurzweil and other wild
life-extensionists offer us.</p>
<p>Neither of us has a strong attachment to a genetic legacy, so it
is more about wishing for them the opportunity should they see it
as such. Or someone else's children. My sister's progeny are
expected not to reproduce and Mary's siblings have mostly gone for
the 3 children with 3 grandchildren per route. R0 > 1.<br>
</p>
<p>The Black Plague lasted roughly four years and took out roughly
50% of the population of 14c Europe? Seems like the antiVaxxers
were right (if in fact wrong-headed)... we missed our chance to
halve in an equally short time? 2 more halvings and we will have
our 1bn?<br>
</p>
<p>Anecdotally the Renaissance is partially attributed to this
massive and abrupt die-off, concentrating material wealth,
increasing the value of personal labor and thus undermining
feudalism, etc. ad n. I'm sure someone will debunk all this, but
it is a "romantic story" in it's own twisted way? <br>
</p>
<p>Maybe the Millenials will quit whining when they all inherit 3.5
houses and 7 cars and 7 laptops and 7 notepad computers and 7
mobile devices and a crushing national debt? I'm still trying to
gift away my father's huge stash of vintage tools 15 years later!<br>
</p>
<p>Elno and Bozos (and Thiel and Andreeson and Page and Buterin and
...) each have made the point that "we need more people" (to
inhabit their Mars/L5-O'Niell space colonies?).</p>
<p>Bah, humbug!</p>
<p> - Steve<br>
</p>
<blockquote> <br>
</blockquote>
<p><br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAA5dAfo5Ytd9GQriF7iWTEw3_QjQ0KD+-wNfjLfzxPM_HZF-WQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div><br>
</div>
<div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">---<br>
Frank C. Wimberly<br>
140 Calle Ojo Feliz, <br>
Santa Fe, NM 87505<br>
<br>
505 670-9918<br>
Santa Fe, NM</div>
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<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Oct 5, 2024, 2:36 PM
Prof David West <<a href="mailto:profwest@fastmail.fm"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">profwest@fastmail.fm</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div style="font-family:Arial">Our science illuminates
global warming.<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial">Our political institutions
are incapable of crafting solutions absent so many
loopholes as the make the exercise near pointless.<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial">Individuals operating in
those institutions are driven by greed, power lust, ego,
and all manner of what the Buddha called "attachments."<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial">davew<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div>On Sat, Oct 5, 2024, at 12:26 PM, Nicholas Thompson
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" id="m_-5461403371870529528qt">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>So in what sense and for what purposes is this
pithy aphorism useful? What exactly is the pith?<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If a metaphor, what is truth in the metaphor, the
positive analog. Nobody ever said that all metaphors
are <i>entirely</i> wrong.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>and yes, I am being pissy.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>n<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">On Sat, Oct 5, 2024 at 11:04 AM steve
smith <<a href="mailto:sasmyth@swcp.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">sasmyth@swcp.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:0px;margin-right:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<blockquote>
<p>All <i>Pithy Aphorisms</i> are wrong, some are
useful?<br>
</p>
</blockquote>
<div>On 10/5/24 9:06 AM, Prof David West wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="font-family:Arial">my affection for
the quote derives from a metaphorical reading,
not a literal one. Something akin to Steve's
differential rates of evolution. I also would
have eschewed 'god like' in favor of 'magical'
ala Clarke's dictum about any sufficiently
advanced technology.<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial">davew<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:Arial"><br>
</div>
<div>On Fri, Oct 4, 2024, at 8:46 PM, Nicholas
Thompson wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
id="m_-5461403371870529528qt-m_3719146269230241149qt">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>I think that this way of talking about
emotions precludes careful thought. First
of all, neurologizing emotions is just to
hide the pea under the wrong thimble. I
don't think paleolithologizig helps much
more. Glen is correct that, whatever an
emotion is, its inputs and outputs are
ontogenetically and culturally determined.
So, fear, for instance, is a relation
between something that we take to be
threatening and something that we hope will
be avoidance. Inputs and outputs are
everything. The rest is just arousal.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>N<br>
</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">On Fri, Oct 4, 2024 at 7:01 PM
steve smith <<a
href="mailto:sasmyth@swcp.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">sasmyth@swcp.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:0px;margin-right:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>Emotions/Limbic systems evolve at
genetic rates, institutions evolve at<br>
</div>
<div>social/cultural rates (maybe the
fastest significant change can<br>
</div>
<div>happen/resolve is in multiple
lifetimes?) but technology is advancing at<br>
</div>
<div>must faster rates?<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Or is this wrong(headed) also?<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>On 10/4/24 3:43 PM, glen wrote:<br>
</div>
<div>> None of that is true, however
romantic it might sound. Depending on<br>
</div>
<div>> how one defines "emotion", that
smells the most true. But the<br>
</div>
<div>> mechanisms of emotion are as
coupled to current reality as is every<br>
</div>
<div>> part of our bodies. To suggest
that, say, the Space Force or methods<br>
</div>
<div>> like quantitative easing are
medieval is just nonsense. Technology is<br>
</div>
<div>> more democratized than it has ever
been. Granted, it takes (a lot) of<br>
</div>
<div>> work to familiarize oneself with
something like how GPS works or how<br>
</div>
<div>> to NOT click on that phishing
email. But to suggest that it's<br>
</div>
<div>> "godlike" says more about the
person than it does about the state of<br>
</div>
<div>> technology.<br>
</div>
<div>><br>
</div>
<div>> On 10/4/24 11:16, Prof David West
wrote:<br>
</div>
<div>>> /"The real problem of humanity
is the following: we have Paleolithic<br>
</div>
<div>>> emotions, medieval
institutions, and godlike technology. And
it is<br>
</div>
<div>>> terrifically dangerous."/
Edward O. Wilson.<br>
</div>
<div>>><br>
</div>
<div>><br>
</div>
<div>><br>
</div>
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<div>Nicholas S. Thompson<br>
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<div>Emeritus Professor of Psychology and
Ethology<br>
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<div>Nicholas S. Thompson<br>
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<div>Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology<br>
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