[FRIAM] Few of you ...

[Steven A Smith]

Marcus -

Ok... I think I did tangent on your point about your dog (as I sit with
two very different dogs at my feet, neither of which have herding
instincts but each with very acute instincts of their own (1 purebred
Akita and doberman mix).

My own experience with mob-behaviour is that there is something about
*my* behaviour/instincts/breeding that has me avoiding mob behaviour.  I
get very uncomfortable even at a sporting event which to me looks like
two acute mobs (teams) backed up by two larger, looser mobs (fans), even
when the general mood is festive.  My own daughter's pre-teen soccer
experiences weren't too bad, but by the time they reached high-school
and were playing volleyball, I could hardly stand to be among the other
parents roaring for their daughter/team and haranguing the ref and
impugning players on the other team.  Mind you, this was Los Alamos,
where the likelihood of food or punches thrown was very low and the
language, while inflammatory was never name-calling or cursing.  I've
wondered if I am *more* prone to entrainment in these situations which
is why I get so uncomfortable.   There is also a contrarian/underdog
current for me that has ME wanting to interfere with my "own side's"
vitriol.

When I was young and likely to be in bars where there WERE bar-fights on
an occasional basis, I was the one likely patron to step between the
pugilists if management wasn't on the spot, always facing the more
belligerent of the two.  I have always found it hard to be around other
people's belligerence without feeling belligerent toward the source
myself.  This is probably just a minor tweak on the instincts that
(also) turn a barfight between two drunk losers into a brawl among
dozens.   It never turned out badly but I grew out of wanting to be
amongst that kind of energy by the time I was in my 30s.

My older daughter was active in the 2004 MoveOn actions in Albuquerque
and was upset a the Police behaviour which was obviously designed to try
to quash any street violence before it started and she naturally felt as
if they  were making the street violence more likely by coming out in
riot-gear before any of the protesters had thrown a rock.   I tended to
agree with her on that belief, yet at the same time she acknowledged
that her organization (local MoveOn) seemed to attract hotheads who
wouldn't be happy in the streets until there *was* a physical
confrontation with police.   She acknowledged that THAT made her very
uncomfortable at every rally when she couldn't be sure when one of those
characters would arrive and throw the first bottle or directly threaten
the Police (or any counter-protestor).   At first she wanted to claim
these were "plants" by the police set there do discredit her movement,
but eventually she acknowledged that while there probably were a *few*
of those, the bulk of the offenders were home-grown in the
organization.  Sadly (I guess) it burned her out pretty bad about
political action.  As she approaches 40 (and is a parent) her views on
movements like Occupy have become almost conservative...  seeking order
over change I suppose.

- Steve

On 1/16/19 4:34 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

> Steve writes:
>
> < There may be psychochemical dynamical systems inside her body involved
>     in maintaining "sight of you" and there likely *were* complex feedback
>     loops in the intentional breeding of her ancestors as well as the
>     natural selection environments that lead her first ancestor (whatever
>     that is) to be chosen as "good stock to start a herding breed from".  >
>
> I thought we were talking about the cause of chanting and this sort of thing.
> I claim it is tendency to seek out similar people and that the affinity has essentially been bred-into some populations.   
> It isn't a conscious decision or something that needs short-horizon dynamics.    It just works out that they show up with people of the same color, economic, or religious background and start chanting about people that are not like them.   Explainable with near-zero intelligence agents.   The "near" part being that it takes some negotiation to make up the similarity function, if ready-made ones like ethnicity are not evident.   
>
> Marcus
>  
>
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