[FRIAM] At the limits of thought

[Frank Wimberly]

> I call Twitch, which someone (on this list) pointed out to me was
discussed in Warren's All the King's Men, arguably my favorite novel.


It was I.  My narcissism requires that I receive the recognition I deserve.

On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 2:38 PM uǝlƃ ☣ <gepropella at gmail.com> wrote:

> Well said! While I don't think I understand the Gröbner basis analogy, I
> would argue that the motivations will also be derived from the world,
> though perhaps more deeply with long memories. [†] Add to that the
> loopiness where the agents co-construct the world that constructs them and
> it's not clear to me that any basis could be well-formed.
>
> Folding this into Jochen's suggestion to Nick, when comparing inheritance
> from path-dependence to inheritance from generators, we'd have to do
> something to handle state. If we went with path-dependence, we'd have to
> define where the saved state accumulates (and presumably rates of decay).
> And like my statement about non-loopy/well-formedness of a potential basis,
> some of the saved state will be stored in the environment and some in the
> gametes. E.g. cities (buildings, roads, utility lines, cell phones, etc.)
> are state saved in the environment (Renee's grandkids don't even know what
> a rotary phone is/does) and things like eye color are state saved in
> gametes. Are the two types of data/state different in kind? Or is there a
> smooth transition between gametes state and environmental state.
>
> I feel confident the functional programming people have had all these
> discussions. 8^) Marcus and Chris once insisted that I'd understand much
> better if I simply read section 3.5 of SICP ... they underestimated just
> how stupid I am, however.
>
> [†] I have argued, even on this list, that perhaps the motivation can be
> unified into something I call Twitch, which someone (on this list) pointed
> out to me was discussed in Warren's All the King's Men, arguably my
> favorite novel. It's not quite clear to me what my conception of Twitch is
> or would be if I took it seriously ... some kind of heat maybe, a pressure
> to explore every crevice of the universe ... a pressure strong enough maybe
> to *create* the universe ... like virtual particles at an event horizon.
>
> On 4/27/20 10:14 AM, Jon Zingale wrote:
> > I like that Sims approaches the problem of AI from the perspective that
> > life is a consequence of the world, that life is the world discovering
> itself.
> > He specifies a learning semantics (genetic algorithms) and a learning
> > syntax (motivation functions and virtual embodiment in time) for his
> creations.
> > His specifications are functor-like in that they determine a structure
> on the
> > world that when probed gives information about the world, more or less
> finely.
> > Through process come functions like crawling, reaching, or defending.
> > Some how these functions follow from motivation, learning and the world.
> > Is it reasonable to interpret them as dependent functions of the
> underlying
> > motivation functions, the motivations acting as a generalized grobner
> basis?
> >
> > To Glen's point, or perhaps the point of the Bengiopaper, if we watch
> long
> > enough and the virtual world has sufficient analog to our own, we can
> begin
> > to experience a transparency of understanding. Still perhaps, the
> understanding
> > is not of the agent but of the world.
>
>
> --
> ☣ uǝlƃ
>
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-- 
Frank Wimberly
140 Calle Ojo Feliz
Santa Fe, NM 87505
505 670-9918
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