[FRIAM] incitement

[David Eric Smith]

I would go Marcus one further.  Stupidity, yes, but not only.  I think an even heavier point is the t**** is a sociopath.  It simply doesn’t matter to him whether a riot occurs, since it will land on somebody else and not him.  Whether sociopaths are “trained” I don’t know, but since his whole life experience has been that everything lands on somebody else and never him, if they could be trained, his life would be the one to do it.  So if he had the capacity to think about consequences, he probably still wouldn’t bother to.  

That does raise a certain question of law, however (not goal, just method and framing).  If you don’t plan ahead for destruction because you are unconcerned whether actions you take might cause it, it seems that shouldn’t be _less_ of a wrongdoing than having incited intentionally.  Since the Richie Ramirez thing appears to be back in the pop consciousness just now (I remember the evening news cycle when I was a boy and that was all going down), we can probably say there is precedent that sociopaths don’t get indemnity.

Eric



> On Jan 19, 2021, at 11:10 AM, Marcus Daniels <marcus at snoutfarm.com> wrote:
> 
> That his lack of caution arises from stupidity as much as it does from malice shouldn't give him any relief. 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> On Behalf Of u?l? ???
> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 8:03 AM
> To: FriAM <friam at redfish.com>
> Subject: [FRIAM] incitement
> 
> How Trump’s language shifted in the weeks leading up to the Capitol riot – 2 linguists explain
> https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2ftheconversation.com%2fhow-trumps-language-shifted-in-the-weeks-leading-up-to-the-capitol-riot-2-linguists-explain-152483&c=E,1,zcp9h6yF_yIGGOaZvOzFvqjq77xR0gD6cn8JNRZJTVAOuTYk_uLEViGSITUuuP-Xn5WNwE-kKg2ENf7JFKVre_520oXeueBJhWG6Mt2UCnkHWYSXBg,,&typo=1
> 
> There's plenty to doubt, there. But it follows along our previous conversations about ambiguity (both [in]formal) and binding. Personally, I don't believe Trump purposefully incited the riot. He'd have to be a literal genius to *purposefully* use language like this with the intent/objectives attributed to him. What does it mean, though, to *accidentally* incite a riot? Where does _mens rea_ fall for incitement? It seems most plausible that Trump is simply pre-adapted to riot-incitement by his years of practiced marketing bullsh¡t and the trendly positive feedback he gets from that marketing bullsh¡t. He did incite a *rally*. He loves when his groupies get together to fawn over him. But did he incite them to riot? I don't think so. Laughable as the idea is, were I a Senator, I'd probably vote to acquit.
> 
> --
> ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ
> 
> - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. .
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6  bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,8a2FKmkiXmYCAvbrwzFlEnhk5Qb6m0j3xJh8A-PKGSosX3vgOxCjMO1v2OMQ7H0ftZl7Dxvi4CWg4taqJflWRRwNTePfva-clja1_nMAUKx5OrRx3fge&typo=1
> archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/
> FRIAM-COMIC https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,W7U463cILJ_k3y7gMtq-WXi7i1THlbClPz-M2bGJU5lD7g3HKnUp2m7K2ssE4YuQMWRfHcPK7YWEW2MxtDdJDK6eTwVhVx2_19Q-LNU2zK6z&typo=1 
> - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. .
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6  bit.ly/virtualfriam
> un/subscribe https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,QeRtgEaeD-tfVrQlIRj5xJXTQ84WjExWqcE_rr7sm8NQGfFdn8K_iKb0QvPpupJhowwjSrDrjLaT19etQbIZN6kvqCoeRS7BSV4yEQkfOI1-iI7Jiw,,&typo=1
> archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/
> FRIAM-COMIC https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,gLDu6KJQnHWWYTbCMNhxhJQmfkGcC4j0GdEeOCqmZb6E3PdUDdmzlPzUaoC_uqjBnrt8LSrgd1CGUdxLC-Keu96U1-Aupe0z4wMMzHQaUMm5&typo=1