[FRIAM] technical notes on fusion announcement
David Eric Smith
desmith at santafe.edu
Sat Dec 24 06:27:01 EST 2022
I remember, as a kid, finding this idea wonderful, after reading one or another biography of Tesla. Probably one of them was Prodigal Genius, by John O’Neill. I remember at some young age, I had a chance to ask a power engineer about this, and got a kind pat on the head, and was told that the thermal loss rates are so high, that you lose most of your input before you can extract it at any significant distance. I never followed up to try to do such a calculation myself.
Sometime, rather later, I had an English teacher who handed me Ayn Rand books, saying she found them hard to get through, and thinking they would keep me quiet for a while because I was generally being an annoyance to her. (I forget this particular woman’s name; she was probably competent, but I don’t remember her class as being enjoyable, and I understood that she disliked me though her behavior never descended from being professional.) They seemed easy enough to read, but I didn’t notice until sometime later that John Galt’s distribution and engine systems were her literary take on Tesla’s ionosphere distribution idea. I didn’t understand (not being a very sophisticated reader), the extent to which Galt was probably meant to be modeled on Tesla. How the same references keep circling back.
Eric
> On Dec 23, 2022, at 9:47 PM, Prof David West <profwest at fastmail.fm> wrote:
>
> Instead of a cable - maybe Tesla’s unrealized broadcast technology? I don’t remember the details but he was going to send power from Long Island, via the ionosphere, to light the world expo in Paris.
>
> Davew
>
> On Thu, Dec 22, 2022, at 2:16 PM, Steve Smith wrote:
>> Following the conception of a Transatlantic power cable, I just heard on the radio that a couple huge globe-ish spanning electrical-busses are under planning... one that might span from Thailand to Saudi Arabia (through northern India) with Solar (and other renewables?) tapping in along the way and load-shifting E/W with the sunlight and load. Also maybe one that spans Australia which I believe to be about as wide as the US?
>>
>> Seems like TX's problems stemming from their own (short-sighted?) self-isolation might be good hosts/promoters of such a long-throw?
>>
>> I don't know what it would take to upgrade the national rail system to also be a load-balancing shadow network for renewable electricity? I assume none of them are electrified (third rail) but maybe laying one, given the pre-existing right-of-way and regular inspection/maintenance/access available would be of interest? But then maybe our FriAM member who is working on converting natural gas to pneumatic energy-transfer/storage knows more about all those issues? Hybridized infrastructure across many types?
>>
>> Maybe the existing Diesel-Electric Engines (most of what is on the rail) could tap in mildly to reduce diesel consumption and do their own load leveling? Fill empty tankers with water at the top of lines (where there *is* water) and carry it to low lying land, extracting the PE from the mass/elevation drop? Reline old asphalt/fuel-oil/etc tankers and provide boutique "Rocky Mountain" (or Cascades) branch-water to the big cities while extracting (maybe) enough energy from the elevation drop to at least pay to haul the damn empties back up the hill?
>>
>> With me as the big "unintended consequence" chicken-little, I'm sure most if not all of my hare-brained schemes are truly just "asking for trouble", but I think it is inevitable that they will all be considered in the spirit of adjacent-technical-possibles...
>>
>> National Railway System: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/mapviewer/index.html?webmap=96ec03e4fc8546bd8a864e39a2c3fc41 <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.arcgis.com%2fapps%2fmapviewer%2findex.html%3fwebmap%3d96ec03e4fc8546bd8a864e39a2c3fc41&c=E,1,ZMPynVeGzBqWRl9lzH6lndaBwpY-q8Uq3vXEy6SLSk0hE4wOdURNSm_HKYXA5lLqNaoC-oln6mM6wAfegxzT8fpSTgJr3Wf06I4P3Cs0VPzU&typo=1>
>>> This fusion video should be the standard for how to present every single technological innovation, every so-called "renewable energy" device that is too little, too late, and most importantly distracts us from thinking seriously about how we shall survive climate catastrophe and continue to live a flourishing life on earth. Thank you Carl--I think you sent this link to the group.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at 10:57 AM cody dooderson <d00d3rs0n at gmail.com <mailto:d00d3rs0n at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> I had never heard of a transatlantic power grid. That is an interesting idea. The sun is probably shining somewhere on the earth at any given time. Would a lot of energy get wasted with the long distances?
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 16, 2022, 10:46 AM Gillian Densmore <gil.densmore at gmail.com <mailto:gil.densmore at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> frank: ah! thanks. It seems like you've had 99 lives man.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at 12:28 AM Marcus Daniels <marcus at snoutfarm.com <mailto:marcus at snoutfarm.com>> wrote:
>>> I like the idea of a large transatlantic DC power cable. That would enable solar power to be distributed around the world. It would reduce the need to depend on batteries for wind and solar. Of course, you raise #3, so it would be a target for sabotage like with Nordstream. It would be nice to think there are things just to valuable to destroy, but probably there are no such things.
>>>
>>> From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com <mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com>> on behalf of Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb at gmail.com <mailto:sroy.mb at gmail.com>>
>>> Sent: Friday, December 16, 2022 12:01 AM
>>> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam at redfish.com <mailto:friam at redfish.com>>
>>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] technical notes on fusion announcement
>>>
>>> What you are missing includes
>>> 1) Disposal of long term hazardous nuclear waste.
>>> 2) Problems in maintaining / decommissioning ol older nuclear fission plants
>>> 3) Examples like we are seeing Ukraine's nuclear plants caught up in a war.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at 2:59 AM Gillian Densmore <gil.densmore at gmail.com <mailto:gil.densmore at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> Ok so this is cool and all.
>>> Sigh I'll ask that question. We want less carbons because the planet is on f'n fire <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFgBFYkBZ6E> . As far as I know humans (in the very least) accelerated climate change. Ie we made this mess clean it up. ok fair so far I'm following.
>>> So uh why not just start with fission (breeders) ? Why not also put as much money into matter/anti matter as well as fusion? We can make minute amounts of antimatter in massive collider. I'd think something who's by product are xrays gamma and some other stuff with a lot of energy created would be a massive honney pot the department of energy would pursue as well.
>>> I know the answer to fission (sadly) is NIMBY. (yes but it's a lot cleaner and safer than oil and coal I say)
>>> I don't know why we haven't looked at other things as well
>>> What I'm saying is fusion has been humans icarus wings with it being just arround the corner for decades. while matter/anti matter is (sort of) here. Fission is here. Want zero carbons? cool! so why not build out a ton of reactors we already can do. Or am I missing something?
>>>
>>> On Wed, Dec 14, 2022 at 8:31 AM Marcus Daniels <marcus at snoutfarm.com <mailto:marcus at snoutfarm.com>> wrote:
>>> How ICF might evolve into a power plant:
>>>
>>> https://firstlightfusion.com/technology/power-plant <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2ffirstlightfusion.com%2ftechnology%2fpower-plant&c=E,1,6wtVMOWMOkZ5Eb7V7x34PQ4G2bSWUo2FlJ6JotmpHMNvIwMLA4jFckXWlrXKviDmpX55pYuHmztMHXsInhQxKPXcCwXjVgi6PCaT4QvYh3KvSNsC&typo=1>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On Dec 14, 2022, at 7:16 AM, glen <gepropella at gmail.com <mailto:gepropella at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Excellent! Thanks. I think I'll have to push this topic for another day. I've got a few more links from other fora I'll plop here just in case I only land back here if/when I pop it off the stack later:
>>>>
>>>> https://lasers.llnl.gov/news/magnetized-targets-boost-nif-implosion-performance <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2flasers.llnl.gov%2fnews%2fmagnetized-targets-boost-nif-implosion-performance&c=E,1,35SDv2qnUk3z0NaiI2LADqkCdzlTdnqWQoI0g3fVrfgLbIDLE2lGQpQ4s_KuNZ2FUMMaV8Q5j8b2HW2coPds7ahOiEY3U5w7K319a-iD&typo=1>
>>>> https://spie.org/news/nuclear-fusion-nifs-hall-of-mirrors-may-solve-worlds-energy-crisis?SSO=1 <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fspie.org%2fnews%2fnuclear-fusion-nifs-hall-of-mirrors-may-solve-worlds-energy-crisis%3fSSO%3d1&c=E,1,xgenYj0qmVY58KdcnCX0L93jz8JpWzu5jWUvMSJp40mRbkOEgPqeXgZ8zCckmSWA6XJMCFFXz0fQJ2xRAuJ2FhrEt3uPKU9pXixjzrnrRpvJYqC_UO1EG-hqeg,,&typo=1>
>>>> https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-power-may-run-fuel-even-gets-started <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.science.org%2fcontent%2farticle%2ffusion-power-may-run-fuel-even-gets-started&c=E,1,XJk5dm_KqW8r8k-gwYIBqJbEJ-3g23mgUn5EmKx1tBSeDmmARJdrTArFy8c5TxZfwxoAFecOrf2Kbz_xRACv0LjjvQ180_uAJ4tEXO4N3ARVAzbWW2IP4LQ2&typo=1>
>>>> https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/12/what-enabled-the-big-boost-in-fusion-energy-announced-this-week/ <https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/12/what-enabled-the-big-boost-in-fusion-energy-announced-this-week/>
>>>>
>>>> On 12/13/22 16:23, Steve Smith wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I think DT refers simply to the remaining fraction of Deuterium/Tritium remaining after the reaction event (-4%) without specific accounting for remaining D vs T.
>>>>> My understanding is that D-T fusion occurs at a lower temperature than D-D but that once fusion commences (starting with D-T), both D-T and D-D reactions occurring in similar amounts. In laser-driven ICF (as with NIF) I believe the ratio of D/T is nominally 50/50 though it would seem to make sense to have a higher T to D ratio but most references I see imply equal portions. An equal number of D-D and D-T reactions would seem to consume D more quickly, though as that commences, the D/T ratio would go down, making D-T reactions (yet) more likely... tricky business, no wonder it has taken decades to get to this point?
>>>>> The Wikipedia Entry on ICF is pretty good: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inertial_confinement_fusion <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inertial_confinement_fusion>
>>>>> I found several popular science Articles which seem to reinforce my sense that this "breakthrough" is not as significant as implied:
>>>>> https://www.science.org/content/article/fusion-breakthrough-nif-uh-not-really <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.science.org%2fcontent%2farticle%2ffusion-breakthrough-nif-uh-not-really&c=E,1,8rty1Hd3To8s3_nqW2H--Qi9QPTem91hbn62EnVdaONzhpUybbuodFpbqCCqIs_-hxAeUXDvgnEs3bwfe5CaduTh-7Hf6wYYtVQp4M469F0mar-ZgPyx&typo=1>
>>>>> Other interesting/relevant links regarding D-T and D-D fusion...
>>>>> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/263507001_Species_separation_and_modification_of_neutron_diagnostics_in_inertial-confinement_fusion/figures?lo=1 <https://www.researchgate.net/publication/263507001_Species_separation_and_modification_of_neutron_diagnostics_in_inertial-confinement_fusion/figures?lo=1>
>>>>> https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.energy.gov%2fscience%2fdoe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions&c=E,1,HPN_izyiW7-qNo4D5CmcTMFQBZXerWbQbUZ5lbtFLiIabXifoCFc1YNdYgr-cAadq-jNyldPNsLtNQ5P8TqcV_x95eX_U8zRJzEspuYzUNE,&typo=1> <https://www.energy.gov/science/doe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.energy.gov%2fscience%2fdoe-explainsnuclear-fusion-reactions&c=E,1,kozsXlRnHAd9h9qBVjqbEsz2M_uHEX8Z2c57E2qiSFxeL5gcMUvfWoqQ2doJCiQbJnmc8LwuuRh97jj2W8Iq_7krANuyHzIeBnMSANhYMCDyNKs,&typo=1>>
>>>>> https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fscience.jrank.org%2fpages%2f4732%2fNuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html&c=E,1,JGjjNa7qVybry6hozUaLaiLats2qZgBdjrBn-P9DVVqk010LAt1Et6T3NLH31b1UAZV_-wsCsPRSbokBAYqb2r9vONGw6n-sogtjzWNTBbXun5GDSyBSLlA,&typo=1> <https://science.jrank.org/pages/4732/Nuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fscience.jrank.org%2fpages%2f4732%2fNuclear-Fusion-D-D-D-T-reactions.html&c=E,1,-fRMMvyBoJKpbTu3WDchaLYzXpcLLoW-7-ikbBAYRQSIJhCVFMQVL6zKN1D7P_P-L9JBSQvktWUqfaovYwfTaA-P5ARG149vhKcKs38zNff_Io9oPdl4J5hJ9Q,,&typo=1>>
>>>>> On 12/13/22 4:36 PM, glen wrote:
>>>>>> That's why I asked. I guess I'll assume DT means both deuterium and tritium, not just deuterium. If you were going to track fuel use, you'd track the rarer part more closely, right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 12/13/22 09:22, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>>>>>>> DT = deuterium?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>> Frank C. Wimberly
>>>>>>> 140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
>>>>>>> Santa Fe, NM 87505
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 505 670-9918 <tel:670-9918>
>>>>>>> Santa Fe, NM
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 13, 2022, 10:21 AM glen <gepropella at gmail.com <mailto:gepropella at gmail.com> <mailto:gepropella at gmail.com <mailto:gepropella at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Awesome. Thanks. I'm still trying to catch up with the QC Wormhole kerfuffle. Who knew Quanta was so click baity?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What is "DT"?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 12/13/22 09:02, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>>>>>>> > In case no one wanted to get up at 7:00am to watch DOE administrators talk:
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 1. Controlling the laser in space and time was important for maintaining symmetry. Timing precision of 25e-12 secs and laser spatial precision of 5e-12 meter were needed. This was thought to be the main explanation for the achievement.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 2. 8% more power on the laser this time
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 3. x-ray tomography is used to find flaws in the capsules. Developing software to do the counting.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 4. They have ongoing efforts to study the fabrication systems and their components (done in Germany) to find idiosyncrasies of each.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 5. Laser technology improvements since NIF was built which are 20% more efficient.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 6. Target cost is from labor, and it takes 7 months each
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 7. 4% of DT is burned in a shot
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 8. Machine learning ties together radiation hydrodynamics and experimental data. (It sounded preliminary.)
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 9. The (successful) capsule had more defects than previous experiments. However, previous experiments did show benefits from capsule quality.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 10. 15% of experiments are indirect drive of this kind, 15% of experiments are other approaches to ignition. The rest are weapons and materials characterization.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > 11. Anomalous laser directional control were problems in the summer runs. Fixed that.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> ꙮ Mɥǝu ǝlǝdɥɐuʇs ɟᴉƃɥʇ' ʇɥǝ ƃɹɐss snɟɟǝɹs˙ ꙮ
>>>>
>>>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,bG_-5VrMUoBaDcdr5gZ9I-ucP8_gcByhXrSyJn1HldUAblS0dPvF1N4LKBDqWED9hX8mRj7nOXip8-7B3xMNJBfVMw_-nzp-WWBM9-4T&typo=1>
>>>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,ZMSZ-IuYwFW57nqefzCjb3iIZYkFN8-_AmJryNZwxS_gBcxpL8ztThl7h3G-OjJR2Pff5aGYF1n4BQ1hZkVRxL6kHEacmqHgt1kmIkQdCQ,,&typo=1>
>>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,6aoYs_2d7z41Hl9wpxtekSKry78Sus8eGYBWg1Lc8bEBy9-bGHMlOM2xBv_qw_UxiCwawg_bGmJnivpZPa643-e2HmotPZpdDamlgGb0VZ2sNg0bb5iwdMN8Dn1j&typo=1>
>>>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,nkGUQUNobV-tLffCidDHB4L825Wn3Qpd9puZ19vts5Aqncmm3dyMr23yELx_PT5TCSlAlWZnGw5P9sRp80HNH0Xaredy8zYHJ_xoGe-3daOEjBE458ho&typo=1>
>>>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>>
>>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,z6qXtLsKhKfMCFsho7lhPRCWtFzYQsGKVftz2kImTUB3D5WYKfx2m_90vLLUPiLCJU7_IWZtQ-j_mfL8UjX6FtYaUIACFg8jui1z1mrhv7wNusk,&typo=1>
>>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,aOXY4Is4fg0YKcv--0aSD-ZKvHtbRdzbFnB8StvyIsY15UE-5sl9Dz9B61UVpRbB3i0M8D_twrtflWOPYtgl-uQS5tqMx0nZZJXnFuLT2Q,,&typo=1>
>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,ogcH3JkN2NVXSjXED2xBThaK7PrmXpl_it9pRwPZ7m7E_BZdhm32U1uoEHnZnzBaEDYD1ZfHYE8iTsDUT7SnuG-7RmDOjZm1C7Z3I4rR&typo=1>
>>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,zEfZIjlZUK7mwuT5qAAMnBGf8IoNZlFukK8FMm8lBBjmRkPhv0h0AZLWMnWF6pcAejohLf5YaX5vucePg0ZW6PG3IABdz2bLZvnJ2MnYYRR0vQ0NhEF9&typo=1>
>>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,-v4pFqgsfVWBy6HicGXxorXU42KKzkMNAfDIA77q9yfec-bRLSSn-G0gsEJ0v76v5Ugza3lSFHQw5F9cfbOvEu6t0dh5D1UDhQ9NW9bo5LkFfkqxuQ,,&typo=1>
>>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,eBVo-d2WzxFEdZ-QJ-ugVyzNYQq7ooOLAtWEOrtcN4qw3xsow8C6g8b9ev11UmgHMAdOl5va3XowDL1U0rGv-LlNblpgPassT5RtFoIbIQ1d1amhJ8ZG&typo=1>
>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,DkDtGhL2Fl2I_6-XuP_O-2AedyhYcmYzEVwGc0-MmFMTiB2SV2MyelUCkWSw5rjrrDlPAJ0ni2Ef6L4gBAcUj-MCYiFR-LNlmdNv6dsmTl2gpelutXf_MdLENA,,&typo=1>
>>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,pSRftLGu65DlOevw52lFBFFo4PtvYGqdm8NIPjS1SUvrDDT6YWzKJ1XH42XPrzDRuXaOKmbZ5xiJ9XSLHwOvJ5Tgo9eLoNKIEhua2ypMnmiePw1HCXiOO9Nh3g,,&typo=1>
>>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,xz_POwh0443Pt0X3iZ1web_-f_MQmTJwd9rij8WGra2h07cryiF7BaQiZuRtyLBqDV5repMDkQEqOcLRd8h2UUweJVTFU1QCcpW8Ge44yvv-g2BOat2--G2_YTnO&typo=1>
>>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,LtxQlRPk7SO-B6O_OhHqvTMduVqJ_xrhBO5lA25NvdyV1QTWM1LnYvhSrqR4Y3umVdELg2exs_EY4Jrq1SvtmAPgWFlMsK_lXkSQgj9vli8t_SEGvlAW1zloDw,,&typo=1>
>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,rgrNYKQwqpRkRn26LA_lvdNnthlWZRihOWrdL-70RNtYgaco4bVW-fdK1acLIpr4w4HNn_MgIZ64wKOb4d_20NJKVhUyrITTDHa52ZEe9wePcWcrjRr2iHQ,&typo=1>
>>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,dbsynxmTP2i_BfK4jawm9BXUZBRgKTiunEnm_-OI6AQIERBSebFyDrRHp9bTsHPcXg1pVZRsfCFntO3d-k1_fkaC7-vsNyCyegutOqzG5hO6MoCI&typo=1>
>>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,7w1llgQ2INxPX3Gu2_BmYQnwgrxCl9vKX7D5GwvmnDaN_FNnS8yf_4GadLwFRVBtd1mSNpUzWtSWIMphbEZOcXajcU_T-HUQrf6xR4lS3R8,&typo=1>
>>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,YTkdQJrYoVC9B3YV3B3xd-E1ipT1_sDo6mO0jUxLW16pw_JYqVk-7LQgkDshxNgsHWLd_4LjtvSudXDRHOPM9n_yGKJ7BZJMoUPqVYubvO50s-ye&typo=1>
>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,6YbB-_SVwsP-jsVJw7Kh50hi6BS1r-uOmEmS8EMQKrN7xCVLai0j98KeikAC7vtorJiUYybsN5hbKiNk8wxtf2KnM8CaeuF8Dv32NbofMHgJI5r3NEnZJJMmdbM,&typo=1>
>>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,etBcL9Mey4k0kjgBOxXYWfbEL7p1-gKkG4k-iPpdR7kMLZWGxjEDarnuyJaoA7N6kTHG7Tqsp_J6UQGmQ8Hz8tXywSDdntcRPnvJ9ArXohDnr1nlTa-lzg,,&typo=1>
>>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,mgaezVcnyxf7aJii3zpd0l7Ws0oR9slQc2bYW4w3a0X8hVux23MsJrlNkEhPjdoYuVjEjXdPYW1fUSYeCtXiop-30XYrG2l1_BLHFruzTurLNRc,&typo=1>
>>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,xLALxK0YrKvf0NpxeWd0iiW4SDrHvjPQGuIZ2ECyAhsIUfTCaQATb9Pxz9Mx1fRjzIBCFmoaUyalfdwBrMxdotGpNCoFJhlk5Nt-pA2WGdYM2kqrQg,,&typo=1>
>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,a1T8DsUz9olhVvkXZz3crbiDMUhadSzbhnxlC3KxlHej9EQlwUe_90DN6L9e_f0GMv9rGikvcm82VjmZMcSk-sND5kHLiiwgSXjaZmZM9t6TpkO2&typo=1>
>>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,Ib-WI2IsgjnZ4EFmkQzYxdVPaPIVp_3k84L3fijMS_YQ827laJ4fCTeSipy3mEbn-As9vnp7Nea8aRBIQeu7FstZDUdEkEKaBPBnaLkfDLK3nYexk_4efhhf8w,,&typo=1>
>>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Merle Lefkoff, Ph.D.
>>> Center for Emergent Diplomacy
>>> emergentdiplomacy.org <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2femergentdiplomacy.org&c=E,1,VDET17F1lwySL7xiuWSq2wkmgsFxCjVO2TrMYNsQYLtAqdLIDdaEKpv7u5LnKbQ7luGeATcAboxkycGkfc8BZ3HLRtzY3l0HUT0NGWTWZ7NUyCGP&typo=1>
>>> Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
>>>
>>> mobile: (303) 859-5609 <tel:(303) 859-5609>
>>>
>>>
>>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,VAlU9fUUxUn3H4UoTM_3vXI52P-FssuWuT-PtDSid6bQ0WqPbBjRtlVsMcf-MUpWuJLuWSAtA4f_D160ArIEOOWn31W1Z2qU4PllKcFR_1M1J-jDQwSBDtzYd8g,&typo=1>
>>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,xS5FzrBHsIm4zrAdPvW3dFQSveAAUPToDQD_XbGdhmZ0t0uZAXsTRtGyBNsxAbYUTAocQF2c71NKciwg8BfK8o_1YJQyLEhwrZjUzc6gzw,,&typo=1>
>>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,gL9qsXHp74caPA5NwMLUdOlj4S0cnmope2ftO84vkrQ4rIyPzKzH07NbiXWZiRf_mlT-tDg831FwbGMzQZXBW_4tLiPpmMCfL8hssQtP&typo=1>
>>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,q-j4XpNdA4gxIQryampgxT_XGyWRfQ9fEhZ_zZhVJYvwtgvbygqcN0Ad9bT2gB7FhGPofV6VlttFSCkptnnHLQQZgZXaAtYV4S_DkV2WSKM,&typo=1>
>>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>>
>> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
>> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
>> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://bit.ly/virtualfriam <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,ONPSHYRjWmCsoUjcTm8K7B1bH5YmtaFhlw5kdtAXbAeMvu4ASESHAx6yC_fTLSkQVVAflqGzTEA92-CwrHlqhkGw840VXeMp1aZ9Pc30HC7J5bk,&typo=1>
>> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,pNswsPqEQ8Vylg-0gkAia-dwW6iIgwtqEkv_Vd1kLHMHDjfgZvCFc6dRnsRaTbRovavv-z5FANF9QUSQIMulXPUlQWIDHVyzV47462qOe49ZqNQ,&typo=1>
>> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,HhhjjAWxNvJFtMqjOm5FPUKiVMQrY_AiOBbtSPf_jy698UVB3oo7vmJOFG9KuZb2bvZW4OGUWcoJVcz7KWEPB0mVnXVnrkAmqW87_5tRn0mPWU-Bs5qGKgoq&typo=1>
>> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,UPS4tAkGkRAMTusC6qC1mXxmu28dhxXpRpILJgu_yIQjc95ATxD1LO4j3Ww3WLLmexn2w59zrGCGOQ6wkMcjs0PIIyZF0mtyyptBMs91sg,,&typo=1>
>> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
>>
>
> -. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,8drNOT-HvLYjUAhUZPkkGnpOFK8EiBR1RnqXzqvU2I4VUL97T_iPklFoumcZtgck97cxLfsQ3eHu6I0mfdcjYQs1bl0ZvpAfTq-hDYcLgu8b&typo=1 <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fbit.ly%2fvirtualfriam&c=E,1,8drNOT-HvLYjUAhUZPkkGnpOFK8EiBR1RnqXzqvU2I4VUL97T_iPklFoumcZtgck97cxLfsQ3eHu6I0mfdcjYQs1bl0ZvpAfTq-hDYcLgu8b&typo=1>
> to (un)subscribe https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,nZgwHC3f8FlDBywb4UynqVikZw6oAUkDYWd03t8Hfd0LqMebRfl-IROZ4ERxJ6XuqgVkvFLbYOFnpxY4Xgo-aszGlLA3x7rGiuyyCMe5Pi2BDZCF6JMN&typo=1 <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fmailman%2flistinfo%2ffriam_redfish.com&c=E,1,nZgwHC3f8FlDBywb4UynqVikZw6oAUkDYWd03t8Hfd0LqMebRfl-IROZ4ERxJ6XuqgVkvFLbYOFnpxY4Xgo-aszGlLA3x7rGiuyyCMe5Pi2BDZCF6JMN&typo=1>
> FRIAM-COMIC https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,oQjzte9iu5ECgCnDAqDP-18Q2p8Aw9-Bc9j1kDT9tbWxuBsfOLPj9UOp5clef__tBQGl_hvYm2yFVgYTqk5IHccqJQEWZgs3bwhUUpYzkFDppLUV8e8,&typo=1 <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffriam-comic.blogspot.com%2f&c=E,1,oQjzte9iu5ECgCnDAqDP-18Q2p8Aw9-Bc9j1kDT9tbWxuBsfOLPj9UOp5clef__tBQGl_hvYm2yFVgYTqk5IHccqJQEWZgs3bwhUUpYzkFDppLUV8e8,&typo=1>
> archives: 5/2017 thru present https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,h3nTAXg0lu7hCYRGSE9HaVyzV70H1S-dJFQXNoKqXq--tBvj-GWnj_NS-zAAVwy-kFm-DX9KCWeDOQGokBGOUqS9NfdxFKsKoajOy030BLfD9kAaDj3NTGk,&typo=1 <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fredfish.com%2fpipermail%2ffriam_redfish.com%2f&c=E,1,h3nTAXg0lu7hCYRGSE9HaVyzV70H1S-dJFQXNoKqXq--tBvj-GWnj_NS-zAAVwy-kFm-DX9KCWeDOQGokBGOUqS9NfdxFKsKoajOy030BLfD9kAaDj3NTGk,&typo=1>
> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ <http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/attachments/20221224/cd2afbd4/attachment-0001.html>
More information about the Friam
mailing list