[FRIAM] Theil

Marcus Daniels marcus at snoutfarm.com
Mon Nov 13 19:30:57 EST 2023

I'm too lazy to run a kmeans now.   

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 13, 2023, at 12:06 PM, glen <gepropella at gmail.com> wrote:
> You might want to check the Gurometer. Lex has an entry:
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Oe-af4_OmzLJavktcSKGfP0wmxCX0ppP8n_Tvi9l_yc/edit?usp=sharing
> While Lex's scores are relatively low compared to some of the wackos on the list, we are known by association. And many of Lex's guests score relatively high.
>> On 11/13/23 10:08, Steve Smith wrote:
>> It seems (maybe only to me?) that "will" is what defines the intersection of memory and imagination?   The free-will-less-ness-ers among us (ala Sopolsky <https://www.theguardian.com/books/2023/oct/24/determined-life-without-free-will-by-robert-sapolsky-review-the-hard-science-of-decisions>) may find this an entirely specious thing to consider or discuss (though without free will, what means "specious" or "discuss" or "consider" sans free-will?).
>> I recently discovered Lex Fridman's podcasts <https://lexfridman.com/podcast/> and was quite surprised by several things (albeit with very limited sampling... all of his most recent interview with Musk and a bit of his interview with Isaacson and about half of the Harari one):   I don't significantly disagree with the general mistrust of Musk in his Autistic-ish style and affect, but I'd say that Lex brings out the best in him, showing him to be capable of thoughtful and even empathetic-ish observations.  As I understand it (from my reading of Isaacson's biography of Musk) brother Kimball may also be a significantly similar "regulating influence" on Elon.   Grimes maybe, maybe not.  The other mothers of his children, same-same... probably each and all of them for a period of time or within certain frameworks.   And again, same with the children... though maybe projection on my part having been moderately well-regulated in several modes by my own children during each of their phases (right up to their current middle-agedness).
>> As an aside, Fridman's other interviews also all sound potentially fascinating... though I cringe at the fact/thought of interviews with Netanyahu, KanYE, Kushner, Rogan...     the commentary I've read around those interviews tends to skew toward "how could you normalize (amplify?) those A**holes by even giving them the time of the day???!!!?".   Lex's interviews are definitely long-form (1-2 hours) compared to today's tik-tok/ad-jingle/bumper-sticker/snark-pith calibrated sound-bitery.    I find myself avoiding them for this reason (not wanting to commit to listening past some of my own prejudices long enough to hear what they are really about?) but recognize (and have already begun to practice) that as with long-form written journalism, I can take it in bits, like I might eat a rich holiday meal... not try to gulp it down quickly in one sitting like a TV-dinner (for you X-ers, "Hot-Pocket", and Millenials == "??") for the mind.
>> My recent fascination with Deacon's "Teleodynamics", Jeff Hawkins' take on the structure/function of the neocortex and Ian McGilchrist's updated  take on brain bicameralism (Master and Emissary <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Master_and_His_Emissary>) feeds into this question of the intersection of memory and imagination and the implications of Transformer Models and other Generative Models in general.   My direct experience with GPT-4 and DALL-E is significant (many 10s of hours of engagement) but still a drop in the bucket.  There are times when I feel that all I've done is engaged with an incredibly high-dimensional french-curve/bezier spline and thereby been able to smoothly interpolate/extrapolate a handful of interesting (to me) data points into what feels like a powerful elaboration of what is implied by said curve-fit in the past (unknown knowns?) and future (unknown unknowns)?    When I'm not totally enraptured by the (apparent?) novelty (relative to my expectations/predictions) of it's responses I'm generally disappointed at it's limited creativity...   and left puzzling over the question of "novelty vs creativity".
>> Bumble,
>>  - Steve
>>> On 11/13/23 10:27 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>>> It seems to me that neither Musk and Thiel are interested in the unknown. They are interested in doing things they can already imagine.    For Musk I thought that was because it is how he raises money.   Now I think he is not imagining consciousness in a, say, a transporter pattern buffer, he imagines life on the Enterprise bridge in his body.   Rockets are comparatively science fictiony for people that can't imagine transport without a car, so he gets some points for that.
>>>> On Nov 13, 2023, at 10:11 AM, glen<gepropella at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>>> There's an interesting parallel between the Stross and Gellman pieces: Stross both laments and implicitly appreciates the bureaucracy of getting a book published, where Thiel's aggrieved by the bureaucracy of societal evolution.
>>>> It reminds me of the engineering-vs-biology dichotomy (yes, false, like all of them) I came to appreciate after being exposed to enough biomimetics (to kill a horse). Some of us see the world and think about how to change it, build a better world ... or perhaps destroy the world, whatever floats your inner engineer. And some of us see the world and are awestruck, hypnotized, baffled by its qualities (whether beautiful or horrifying). It's easy to give the latter a pass and denigrate the former when confronted with, say, butterflies or the Grand Canyon. And it's easy to give the former a pass when confronted with poverty and war.
>>>> But the next time you're at the DMV or arguing with some poor sucker manning the phones at the IRS, it can be useful to remember the falseness of the dichtomy. Similarly, when all you want to do is sleep under the stars and those damned gnats keep homing into your ears, it can be useful to think like an engineer.
>>>> Policy and science fiction aren't that far apart.
>>>>> On 11/10/23 13:46, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>>>>> original.png
>>>>> Peter Thiel Is Taking a Break From Democracy<https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2023/11/peter-thiel-2024-election-politics-investing-life-views/675946/?utm_source=copy-link&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=share>
>>>>> On 11/10/23 11:26, Roger Critchlow wrote:
>>>>> Text of Charlie Stross' talk to Next Frontiers Applied Fiction Day in Stuttgart on Friday November 10th, 2023, concerning where the techno-industrial elite found their horrible philosophies/secular religions.
>>>>> https://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2023/11/dont-create-the-torment-nexus.html
>>>> --
> --
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