[FRIAM] nice quote
steve smith
sasmyth at swcp.com
Sat Oct 5 18:40:46 EDT 2024
Nick -
I don't mind offering my sense of what the aphorism is all about, I just
want to give others a chance to chime in before I start defending myself
in my overly-voluminous manner.
Can you meet me half-way with *any* sense of signal in what you are
suggesting might be pure noise (or misdirection or a just-so type
story)? A rusty pot-metal man argument perhaps? (duck here comes
another SG/DALL-E rendering!)
- Steve
> I am trying not to be a jerk here, but maybe jerkiness Is so
> centralto my being that I cannot avoid it.
>
> I promise you, the question was not meant to be (entirely)rhetorical.
> Glen has long since taught me that nobody uses words for absolutely
> nothing and if you folks see some meaning in that aphorism, there must
> be something to it. what is that something?
>
> Nicholas S. Thompson
> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology
> Clark University
> nthompson at clarku.edu
> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson
>
>
> On Sat, Oct 5, 2024 at 5:49 PM steve smith <sasmyth at swcp.com> wrote:
>
> Nick -
>
> And here I thought *I* was being "pithy", then you call me out
> on my lithp?! ;^)
>
> The strawman arguments have started coming out, I wonder if
> anyone will gen up a steelman?
>
> - tinman Steve
>
>
>
> On 10/5/24 11:26 AM, Nicholas Thompson wrote:
>> So in what sense and for what purposes is this pithy aphorism
>> useful? What exactly is the pith?
>>
>> If a metaphor, what is truth in the metaphor, the positive
>> analog. Nobody ever said that all metaphors are /entirely/ wrong.
>>
>> and yes, I am being pissy.
>>
>> n
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 5, 2024 at 11:04 AM steve smith <sasmyth at swcp.com> wrote:
>>
>> All /Pithy Aphorisms/ are wrong, some are useful?
>>
>> On 10/5/24 9:06 AM, Prof David West wrote:
>>> my affection for the quote derives from a metaphorical
>>> reading, not a literal one. Something akin to Steve's
>>> differential rates of evolution. I also would have eschewed
>>> 'god like' in favor of 'magical' ala Clarke's dictum about
>>> any sufficiently advanced technology.
>>>
>>> davew
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Oct 4, 2024, at 8:46 PM, Nicholas Thompson wrote:
>>>> I think that this way of talking about emotions precludes
>>>> careful thought. First of all, neurologizing emotions is
>>>> just to hide the pea under the wrong thimble. I don't think
>>>> paleolithologizig helps much more. Glen is correct that,
>>>> whatever an emotion is, its inputs and outputs are
>>>> ontogenetically and culturally determined. So, fear, for
>>>> instance, is a relation between something that we take to
>>>> be threatening and something that we hope will be
>>>> avoidance. Inputs and outputs are everything. The rest is
>>>> just arousal.
>>>>
>>>> N
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Oct 4, 2024 at 7:01 PM steve smith
>>>> <sasmyth at swcp.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Emotions/Limbic systems evolve at genetic rates,
>>>> institutions evolve at
>>>> social/cultural rates (maybe the fastest significant
>>>> change can
>>>> happen/resolve is in multiple lifetimes?) but
>>>> technology is advancing at
>>>> must faster rates?
>>>>
>>>> Or is this wrong(headed) also?
>>>>
>>>> On 10/4/24 3:43 PM, glen wrote:
>>>> > None of that is true, however romantic it might
>>>> sound. Depending on
>>>> > how one defines "emotion", that smells the most true.
>>>> But the
>>>> > mechanisms of emotion are as coupled to current
>>>> reality as is every
>>>> > part of our bodies. To suggest that, say, the Space
>>>> Force or methods
>>>> > like quantitative easing are medieval is just
>>>> nonsense. Technology is
>>>> > more democratized than it has ever been. Granted, it
>>>> takes (a lot) of
>>>> > work to familiarize oneself with something like how
>>>> GPS works or how
>>>> > to NOT click on that phishing email. But to suggest
>>>> that it's
>>>> > "godlike" says more about the person than it does
>>>> about the state of
>>>> > technology.
>>>> >
>>>> > On 10/4/24 11:16, Prof David West wrote:
>>>> >> /"The real problem of humanity is the following: we
>>>> have Paleolithic
>>>> >> emotions, medieval institutions, and godlike
>>>> technology. And it is
>>>> >> terrifically dangerous."/ Edward O. Wilson.
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Nicholas S. Thompson
>>>> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology
>>>> Clark University
>>>> nthompson at clarku.edu
>>>> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson
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>>
>> --
>> Nicholas S. Thompson
>> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology
>> Clark University
>> nthompson at clarku.edu
>> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson
>>
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