[FRIAM] narrative

[steve smith]

> Why language models collapse when trained on recursively generated text
> https://arxiv.org/abs/2412.14872
Without doing more than scanning this doc, I am lead to wonder at just 
what the collective human knowledge base (noosphere?) is if not a 
recursively generated text?   An obvious answer is that said recursive 
text/discourse also folds in sensori-motor engagement in the larger 
"natural world" as it unfolds...  so it is not *entirely* masturbatory 
as the example above appears to be.
>
> seems to make the point in a hygienic way (even if ideal or 
> over-simplified). We make inferences based on "our" (un-unified) past 
> inferences, build upon the built environment, etc. In the humanities, 
> I guess it's been called hyperreality or somesuch. Notice the infamous 
> Catwoman died a few days ago.
I need to review the "hyperreality" legacy... I vaguely remember the 
coining of the term in the 90s?
>
> It all (even the paper Roger just posted) reminds me of a response I 
> learned from Monty Python: "Oh, come on. Pull the other one." And 
> FWIW, I think this current outburst on my part spawns from this essay:
>
> Life is Meaningless: What Now?
> https://youtu.be/3x4UoAgF9I4?si=7uVDeiDQ8STTJtv7
>
> In particular, "he [Camus] has to introduce the opposing 
> concept—solidarity. This solidarity is a way of reconstructing mutual 
> respect and regard between people in the absence of transcendent 
> values, hence his argument for a natural sense of shared humanity 
> since we are all forever struggling against the absurd."

Fascinating summary/treatment of Camus and the kink he put in 
Existentialism...  familiar to me in principle but in this moment, with 
this presentation and your summary, and perhaps the "existential crisis 
of this moment" (as discussed with Jochen on a parallel thread?) it is 
particularly poignant.

Thanks for offering some "solidarity" of this nature during what might 
be a collective existential crisis.   Strange to realize that it might 
be "as good as it gets" to rally around the "meaninglessness of life"?

>
> On 1/7/25 09:40, steve smith wrote:
>> Regarding Glen's article "challenging the 'paleo' diet narrative".   
>> I'm sure their reports are generally accurate and in fact 
>> homo-this-n-that have been including significant plant sources into 
>> our diets for much longer than we might have suspected.  Our Gorilla 
>> cousins at several times our body mass and with significantly higher 
>> muscle tone live almost entirely on low-grade vegetation.    But the 
>> article presents this as if ~1M years of hominid development across a 
>> very wide range of ecosystems was monolithic?  There are still near 
>> subsistence cultures whose primary source of nourishment is animal 
>> protein (e.g. Aleuts,  Evenki/Ewenki/Sami)?
>>
>> I'm a fan of the "myth of paleo" even though I'm mostly vegetarian.   
>> I like the *idea* of living a feast/famine cycle and obtaining most 
>> of my nutrition from fairly primary/raw sources. Of course, my modern 
>> industrial embedding has me eating avocados grown on Mexican-Cartel 
>> owned farms and almonds grown in the central valley of California on 
>> river water diverted from the Colorado river basin.   <sigh>.
>
>> On 1/7/25 06:21, glen wrote:
>>>
>>> Archaeological study challenges 'paleo' diet narrative of ancient 
>>> hunter–gatherers
>>> https://phys.org/news/2025-01-archaeological-paleo-diet-narrative-ancient.html 
>>>
>>>
>>> Renee' convinced me to eat fried chicken the other night. ... Well, 
>>> OK. She just put it in front of me and my omnivorous nature took 
>>> over. Fine. It's fine. Everything's fine. But it reminded me of the 
>>> fitness influencers and their obsession with chicken and [ahem] 
>>> "protein". Then I noticed the notorious non-sequitur science 
>>> communicator Andrew Huberman is now platforming notorious 
>>> motivated-reasoning through evolutionary psychology guru Jordan 
>>> Peterson. Ugh. And Jan 6 is now a holiday celebrating those morons 
>>> who broke into the Capitol. Am I just old? Or is the world actually 
>>> going to hell in a handbasket? Get off my lawn!
>>>
>
>