[FRIAM] Entropy RE-redux

Mon Jun 16 23:29:47 EDT 2025

Underdetermined language is great for delegation given some shared knowledge, or a willingness to adopt certain assumptions. It’s terrible when there isn’t shared knowledge. Then you get endless language games. Using formal systems, like code, give LLMs the ability to ensure sound logical entailment by delegating to a deterministic system. Meanwhile, LLMs give users the ability to invert the well-determined semantics, like code, back to natural language. That explanation can be useful for education but is not very good for debugging. For debugging, it is better to nail semantics down and change one thing at a time. Claude and George can switch back and forth. Claude often uses deterministic delegation during quantitative conversations. 

From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> on behalf of Nicholas Thompson <thompnickson2 at gmail.com>
Date: Monday, June 16, 2025 at 8:01 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam at redfish.com>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Entropy RE-redux 

George is ambivalent on this point but I can make him ambivalent on any point. I think it’s time for me to retire from the disorder once again. I’ve gone back to feeling that I don’t even know enough to ask a question. 

Sent from my Dumb Phone 

On Jun 16, 2025, at 4:03 PM, Frank Wimberly <wimberly3 at gmail.com> wrote: 

You've probably done this. Nick. 

Yes, entropy (S) is a state variable in thermodynamics. 

Here's what that means: 

* Definition of a State Variable: A state variable (or state function) is a property of a thermodynamic system that depends only on the current state of the system, not on the path or process taken to reach that state. If a system is in a particular equilibrium state, its state variables will have specific, unique values. 

* Why Entropy is a State Variable: 

* Path Independence: The change in entropy between two states is the same regardless of the reversible or irreversible path taken to go from the initial state to the final state. 

* Unique Value for a Given State: For any given equilibrium state of a system (defined by other state variables like temperature, pressure, and volume), there is a unique value of entropy. 

* Mathematical Property: Mathematically, a quantity is a state variable if its differential is an exact differential, meaning that its integral over a closed path is zero. This is true for entropy. 

* Contrast with Path Variables: In contrast, quantities like heat (Q) and work (W) are not state variables. The amount of heat transferred or work done depends entirely on the specific path followed during a process. 

In summary, entropy is a fundamental property that characterizes the state of a thermodynamic system and is independent of its history. 

---
Frank C. Wimberly
140 Calle Ojo Feliz, 
Santa Fe, NM 87505

505 670-9918
Santa Fe, NM 

On Sun, Jun 15, 2025, 9:27 AM Nicholas Thompson <thompnickson2 at gmail.com <mailto:thompnickson2 at gmail.com>> wrote: 

Same setup as before. Cylinder with two plungers and a peggable slider at dead center. Lets fill our compartments with bbs of the same volume. Unpeg the divider. Now lets tap on the two opposite plungers with a series of blows of the same average magnitude but different but different positive skew in the distribution of magnitudes. Will the divider move? 

-- 
Nicholas S. Thompson 

Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology 

Clark University 

nthompson at clarku.edu <mailto:nthompson at clarku.edu> 

https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson <https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson> 

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