[FRIAM] Abduction

Wed Jan 2 17:54:54 EST 2019

> Why hast thou forsaken me?

>  

> Nick

Well, did you pay your tithes last month????

It is really kind of silly to think that one can either characterize
oneself, or be characterized by others, as Dionysian or Apollonian. the
concept has become so mucked up since Nietzsche used the notions to
define tragedy (a folly of his youth).  The absurd overlay / infusion of
Islamo-Judeo-Christo morality delivered a death blow to the whole idea.
In Greek Philosophy ones behavior (and thoughts if you want to allow
such) were grounded in complex blend of the the two traits; and
consequently everyone was "ambiguous" with regard to them. The
intolerance of ambiguity among the People of the Book and most of
Western culture, keeps trying to push for a two valued logic which is
not useful.
If you want to use the terms as metaphors, Apollonian vs. Dionysian
could correspond to 1) cortex vs. amygdala; or 2) right-brain vs. left-
brain. Everyone knows that any behavior is simultaneously grounded in
both elements, but to an observer, including an internal one, any given
behavior might seem to be predominantly influenced by one or the other.
My claim to "Apollonian" is grounded in a long ago commitment to
following the precepts of Jinyana (Jnana) Yoga. first in Vedic
literature, the Buddhism and Taoism — Ch'an Buddhism --> Zen. I strive
to make all of my behavior deliberate and intentional within a meta-
rational and meta-logical context, utilizing the cortex / left-brain as
a filter.  If you ever read Korzibski, there echos in my head of his "cortico-
thalamic pause."
Feel free to reduce the preceding mumbo-jumbo to: its all behavior, and
each behavior is grounded in the complexity of the whole organism.
davew

On Wed, Jan 2, 2019, at 11:18 AM, Nick Thompson wrote:
> Dave,

>  

> Thou deniest me in my moment of need!

>  

> Thou castest me to the wolves (eg Marcus).

>  

> Why hast thou forsaken me?

>  

> Nick

>  

> Nicholas S. Thompson

> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology

> Clark University

> http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/

>  

>  

> -----Original Message----- From: Friam [mailto:friam-
> bounces at redfish.com] On Behalf Of Prof David West Sent: Wednesday,
> January 02, 2019 10:49 AM To: friam at redfish.com Subject: Re: [FRIAM]
> Abduction>  

> Sorry Nick,

>  

> I am as hardcore Apollonian as is possible.

>  

> And if you organize your life around pleasure, even if moderate and
> consistent, it is you that are the Dionysian.>  

> davew

>  

>  

> On Wed, Jan 2, 2019, at 10:02 AM, Nick Thompson wrote:

> > Dave,

> >

> > I realize that you (and perhaps others of our colleagues here) are> > Dionysians, whereas I, always, have been a stalwart Apollonian. The> > difference, for me, is the risk one is willing to take for a peak> > experience of some sort.  Some people organize their lives around> > their vacations and holidays.  I hate holidays and vacations and

> > organize my life around a steady diet of moderate pleasure.  If you
> > see what I mean.> > For instance, I have never dreamed about what mushrooms might do
> > for me.> > Is that a fair statement of a difference between us? 

> >

> > Nick

> >

> > Nicholas S. Thompson

> > Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology Clark University

> > http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/

> >

> > -----Original Message-----

> > From: Friam [mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com] On Behalf Of
> > Prof David> > West

> > Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2019 7:05 AM

> > To: friam at redfish.com

> > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Abduction

> >

> > MDMA risks = dehydration, in part because it is usually taken in the> > context of frenetic physical activity like at a rave. Disinhibition> > can pose a secondary risk because partner selection is less

> > discerning. Like too many drugs, long term effects / gender
> > different> > effects / age different effects, are unknown because unstudied.

> >

> > davew

> >

> >

> > On Tue, Jan 1, 2019, at 7:46 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote:

> > > The premise of the series is that a drug + counseling is used to> > > mitigate PTSD symptoms, but in fact it ends-up deleting recent
> > > memories> > > and was intended to make soldiers able to continue service.   

> > >

> > > One might argue that accumulation of emotional trauma is part of
> > > one's> > > personality, and relieving it destroys part of a person.   One
> > > might> > > also argue that to have just one personality, developing on a

> > > contiguous timeline, is a sort of arbitrary confinement -- like> > > living in a freezer that just keeps getting colder.

> > >

> > > I don't know what the actual risks are of MDMA.  Alcohol's side
> > > effects,> > > in terms of impairment of judgement, are already pretty dangerous.> > >

> > > Marcus

> > >

> > > On 1/1/19, 7:23 PM, "Friam on behalf of glen"

> > > <friam-bounces at redfish.com on behalf of gepropella at gmail.com[1]>
> > > wrote:> > >

> > >     I don't understand what you mean? Are you asking why

> > > psychedelics are not prescribable? Or saying that their
> > > therapeutic> > > effect is negligible?

> > >    

> > >     FWIW, I haven't seen Homecoming.

> > >    

> > >     On January 1, 2019 11:28:28 AM PST, Marcus Daniels

> > > <marcus at snoutfarm.com> wrote:

> > >     >Watching Homecoming I found myself thinking, "Yes, so what's> > > the big

> > >     >deal?"

> > >     >

> > >     >On 12/31/18, 1:40 PM, "Friam on behalf of uǝlƃ ☣"

> > >     ><friam-bounces at redfish.com on behalf of
> > >     >gepropella at gmail.com[2]>> > > wrote:

> > >     >

> > >     >    We're getting closer EVERY DAY!

> > >     >   

> > >     >      https://psi-2020.org/

> > >     >   

> > >     >    Oh, and if anyone needs a charity to toss some 2018 money
> > >     >    at:> > >     >   

> > >     >      https://maps.org/

> > >     >   

> > >     --

> > >     glen

> > >    

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> > >

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>  

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Links:

  1. mailto:friam-
     bounces at redfish.com%20on%20behalf%20of%20gepropella at gmail.com
  2. mailto:friam-
     bounces at redfish.com%20on%20behalf%20of%20gepropella at gmail.com
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