[FRIAM] falsifying the lost opportunity updating mechanism for free will

[Frank Wimberly]

I think regret is more affective than that.  I should have asked my
deceased father about his mother.

---
Frank C. Wimberly
140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
Santa Fe, NM 87505

505 670-9918
Santa Fe, NM

On Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:26 PM <thompnickson2 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Sometimes I feel, for a moment, that I understand some aspect of the
> argument you-guys are having and then I want to participate.  Without
> knowing jack-squat about neural networks, it just seems to me that
> coherence is something that a neural-net could be designed to care about.
> And so, if I do something, and, as a consequence, learn something about
> contingencies I did not know before, it would seem to me that a network
> might go about reorganizing in terms of the new information and that THAT
> is what we might mean by "regret."  "Did that once; ain;t going to do it
> again."
>
> N
>
> Nicholas Thompson
> Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
> Clark University
> ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com
> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> On Behalf Of ? u?l?
> Sent: Monday, June 22, 2020 8:37 AM
> To: FriAM <friam at redfish.com>
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] falsifying the lost opportunity updating mechanism
> for free will
>
> Well, first, I'm not making a claim, only tossing a wet noodle mechanism
> at the wall to see if it'll stick.
>
> I think canalizing flow is missing 2 key components of the mechanism I
> proposed: 1) composition and 2) dampening edits or negative reinforcement.
> (1) is less important. I think I could steelman your weaker form of
> composition well enough say it's a member of this class of mechanisms. But
> (2) is important. Canalizing flow is positive reinforcing. But the point of
> a feedback loop (and iteration as opposed to instantaneous composition)
> trying to capture *lost opportunity* is to lower the chances of following
> the same path next time and raise the chances of following a different path
> next time.
>
> To map back to a vernacular "free will", this mechanism implements it by
> *regret* and post-hoc rationalization. So, to coerce it into some kind of
> canalization, at a bare minimum, the mechanism would need some force for
> mixing or heat, some way to scramble *against* positive reinforcement. But
> that would only be a force for neutral distributions ... e.g. "If I had the
> chance to do it all over again FRESH". That doesn't go far enough. To
> capture lost opportunity and regret, we have to have "If I had the chance
> to do it all over again KNOWING WHAT I KNOW NOW".
>
> This is why I included the scaffolding for pattern matching and iteration.
> The mechanism has to be able to exhibit negative feedback.
>
> On 6/20/20 9:31 AM, Jon Zingale wrote:
> > Glen's Claim:
> > a) a mesh of parallel processes evolving in time
> > b) each process has a local branching structure
> > c) these branches (and the events that walk them) compose
> > d) that composition is monitored and remembered within some scope
> > e) that monitor/memory is used by a controller to edit the branching
> > structures
> >
> > Heraclitus says: "No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's
> > not the same river and he's not the same man."
> >
> > From the Eulerian perspective, fluid flowing through a river delta has
> > many of the characteristics of Glen's theory. We can imagine the river
> > delta as a mesh of composed local branching structures, whose /events/
> > are the ensemble particles of the flow (a,b,c). The flow /monitors/
> > the river delta directly, it experiences the changes in gradients and
> shear (d1).
> > The flow /memories/ the river delta by acting on the delta directly,
> > it frees sediment at one stage only to deposit it at a further stage
> > (d2). Through time, the flow's monitoring and remembering /edits/ the
> > branching structure of the river delta, giving rise to phenomena like
> > distributaries and important to our /free will/-discussion delta
> switching (e).
>
>
> --
> ☣ uǝlƃ
>
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