[FRIAM] PSC Tornado Visualization (2008) [720p] - YouTube

Thu May 14 10:41:35 EDT 2020

Which email has that parody of Trump attached to it?  Very funny.

On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 6:29 AM Steven A Smith <sasmyth at swcp.com> wrote:

>
> On 5/13/20 9:52 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>
> Experiment with a modern implementation of generative adversarial networks
> for a while and I think you’ll begin to feel less smug about the
> superiority of first principles – sort of like a craft of Colonial
> Williamsburg.    Computer, just get me the equations and spare the drama.
>
> My mother was the source (vehicle) of many aphorisms, some of which I
> found particularly maddening.
>
> "If you can't tell (the difference), it doesn't matter!"
>
> was perhaps the most notable and I suppose an archetypal example of
> vernacular pragmatism (Nick).
>
> I *think* this discussion (or this subthread) has devolved to suggesting
> that predictive power is the only use of modeling (and simulation) whilst
> explanatory power is not (it is just drama?).
>
> It is not my feeling or experience or intuition that the explanatory power
> (illusion) of deriving things from first principles is unimportant or
> irrelevant, but I don't know that I have anything but "a strong feeling" to
> back that up.   When I went to college I had a modestly broad command of
> math and basic science which I found very satisfying as a basis for
> (thinking I did) understand a lot about the world as it unfolded around me
> (dust-devils, thunderstorms, motorcycle accidents, auto mechanics,
> mechanical constructions) but as I learned calculus, I somehow felt like
> I'd been handed a whole new toolkit... a way to peel back the covers from
> the myriad equations that had been handed to me with no real explanatory
> power.
>
> Having the equations of motion had seemed like "enough" until I began to
> explore their derivations.   Most of my peers were in engineering and while
> they also were learning calculus, they did not seem to have the same
> fascination... they were much less interested (in my apprehension) in
> "understanding things" than they were "predicting things" and even
> prediction was in service to the utility of "building a thing".   In
> physics, each layer of more fundamental theory, no matter how hard or
> obscure it was, was very satisfying.  Again, my engineering peers were
> puzzled by why I would care about relativity or quantum mechanics when they
> saw so little (if any) application for it.  Of course today, nearly 50
> years later, the applications are pervasive in the more advanced
> engineering applications  (electrooptics, materials science, etc.)
>
> I'll be interested to see how (if?) this distinction unfolds with others
> here.   Maybe my mother was right "if you can't tell the difference, it
> doesn't matter".
>
> - Steve
>
>
>
>
> *From: *Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> <friam-bounces at redfish.com> on
> behalf of "thompnickson2 at gmail.com" <thompnickson2 at gmail.com>
> <thompnickson2 at gmail.com> <thompnickson2 at gmail.com>
> *Reply-To: *The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
> <friam at redfish.com> <friam at redfish.com>
> *Date: *Wednesday, May 13, 2020 at 8:40 PM
> *To: *'The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group'
> <friam at redfish.com> <friam at redfish.com>
> *Subject: *Re: [FRIAM] PSC Tornado Visualization (2008) [720p] - YouTube
>
>
>
> Old Philosophical Joke:
>
>
>
> Deep in a remote valley lived a tribe that had never been in contact with
> the modern world … except for one monastery which corresponded with
> Greenwich village to get the sunrise tables.  The monks would get up 15
> minutes early and sound a bell, which the villagers believed was the cause
> of the sun rising.  It was said, “The monks awakened the sun from his
> slumbers.”  Because of this belief, offerings of every kind were left by
> the village on the steps of the monastery, and the monks grew fat and
> happy.
>
>
>
> In the course of the annual correspondence to get the new sunrise tables
> from Greenwich, one of the British scientists questioned the morality of
> the scam the monks were running.  The monks responded, “As long as they get
> their sunrise on time, who cares?”
>
>
>
> I care.
>
>
>
> Another old Philosophical Joke:
>
>
>
> A man who claimed to be able to fly, announced on his facebook page that
> he was going to demonstrate his skill by jumping off the top balcony of a
> residential tower.  Psychologists were stationed at each balcony below with
> stop watches and clipboards to document his behavior during his “flight”.
> As he went by each successive balcony he was heard to say, “So far, so
> good.”
>
>
>
> His widow cared.
>
>
>
> Your query, Marcus, highlights the difference between philosophical
> pragmatism and the vernacular kind.
>
>
>
> Nick
>
>
>
> Nicholas Thompson
>
> Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
>
> Clark University
>
> ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com
>
> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> <friam-bounces at redfish.com> *On
> Behalf Of *Marcus Daniels
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 13, 2020 9:23 PM
> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
> <friam at redfish.com> <friam at redfish.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] PSC Tornado Visualization (2008) [720p] - YouTube
>
>
>
> Nick writes:
>
>
>
> “The result looks so much like iconic tornado vids that we wannabee
> tornado chasers idolize that one suspects that the video was back
> constructed from that film, rather than developing organically from the
> physics.”
>
> Suppose the equations were extracted, or the behavior re-generated, from a
> deep neural net (or whatever automated machine learning thing), but
> nonetheless were predictive of other tornados.    One might reasonably ask,
> “Who cares?”
>
> Marcus
>
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-- 
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