[FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

[Marcus Daniels]

I don’t really see what the big deal is in the comic.   Just someone being frustrated in their self-talk.
It seems like you are being very literal.

I would also drop people not wearing seatbelts to the back of the line at an ER.
Or don’t even scoop them up.   I don’t care if people wear seatbelts or not, but don’t make the rest of us pay for their lifetime of being fed through a tube.   Actually I’ve fine for paying for all of this, but the COVID-19 thing is a nice example of stupidity that should have consequences.

From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> On Behalf Of Eric Charles
Sent: Monday, August 30, 2021 2:33 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam at redfish.com>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

I'm fine with anti-drunk driving laws,  but against wearing-seatbelt laws.  And either way,  it's the crazy mentality I am most abundantly against.

If you resent the existence of drunk drivers,  because you think they are somehow forcing you to drive sober,  that's really weird.

Ditto if you make the meme about seatbelts.

Proudly owning your decision to put others first makes sense.  But the mentality in the comic is toxic,  and should be avoided.



On Mon, Aug 30, 2021, 12:39 PM cody dooderson <d00d3rs0n at gmail.com<mailto:d00d3rs0n at gmail.com>> wrote:
As a thought experiment, imagine that the person in the cartoon is walking through a group of drunk people getting into their cars. Does the cartoon still bother you or is it somehow related to the politics behind masks?

The laws against drunk driving is also an authoritarian rule that limits my liberty. Even seat belt laws limit my liberty. Is it wrong to agree with some authoritarians when they make sense?

Cody Smith


On Sat, Aug 28, 2021 at 8:51 AM <thompnickson2 at gmail.com<mailto:thompnickson2 at gmail.com>> wrote:
I stand by the flag of Bleeding Heart Liberalism ready to do battle with you guys.

n

Nick Thompson
ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com<mailto:ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com>
https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/

From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com<mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com>> On Behalf Of Eric Charles
Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2021 10:06 AM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam at redfish.com<mailto:friam at redfish.com>>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Marcus,
It does take the "bleeding hearts" some time to get to "othering". That said, it's been a while since this started, and the vast majority I know are there now.


On Fri, Aug 27, 2021 at 4:47 PM Marcus Daniels <marcus at snoutfarm.com<mailto:marcus at snoutfarm.com>> wrote:
Nah, it takes the bleeding hearts some time to get to othering.   They need some moral support to do it.

From: Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com<mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com>> On Behalf Of Eric Charles
Sent: Friday, August 27, 2021 12:51 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam at redfish.com<mailto:friam at redfish.com>>
Subject: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

We talk politics sometimes and the "liberal paradox" has come up. This seems like a variation on that. I've seen this comic for half a year now, and it bugs me every time.

There is 1) an arrogance to "RIGHT THING", 2) an assumption that anyone acting differently than you cannot have any explanation for their behavior other than selfish idiocy, and 3) a self-centered belief that their behavior is somehow a factor of you, rather than a choice of their own. Even worse than those, 4) there is some fundamental lack of decision-ownership that leads to some insidious places: The assertion that what others are doing leads you to "have to" do something --- HAVE TO --- rather than it being one of many factors that play into your choosing to do it.

I'm vaccinated, and I wear a mask in public, and I dislike everything this comic seems to be standing for. It is anti-liberal. It reveals deeply authoritarian leanings, and a firm dedication to "othering" those around you.

[https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=172d55814e&attid=0.1&th=17b98f600670e735&view=fimg&rm=17b98f600670e735&sz=w1600-h1000&attbid=ANGjdJ8cpgWPgPwrPIFo39eGa7QzykraAY76qC2YghrGW_NyUckl8h58fj2JM4L9zx-TfUPqQnPZSzLdqvPKMHUf51c2K0NnlgtszetLUBudJhzn3-YyvTCN0HJ_]

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