[FRIAM] Political compass teest
Steve Smith
sasmyth at swcp.com
Mon Oct 12 22:50:35 EDT 2020
Carl -
Acknowledged. The foreground/background thing is always tricky. I
don't mean to attribute any reality to "personal freedoms", yet somehow
"not being an ass" is something *like* respecting others "personal
freedoms", even though such are in some sense an illusion. Perhaps
someone can articulate this better than I have?
- Steve
> Steve,
>
> You assume I have some fealty to the notion of "personal freedoms".
> Perhaps that is unwarranted. I just see no reason to be an ass.
>
> >>I don't know you well Carl, but from what I do think I know, you
> are clearly *very* independent and *very* considerate of others
> and their personal freedoms. That sounds pretty *l*ibertarian to
> me FWIW.
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 12, 2020 at 10:18 AM Steve Smith <sasmyth at swcp.com
> <mailto:sasmyth at swcp.com>> wrote:
>
> Carl Tollander wrote:
>> -9,-8.1
>> But I do think it would depend a bit on the day.
>> Oddly, never thought of myself as a libertarian.
>
> I think some pretty strong *Fascists* co-opted the term
> "Libertarian" for themselves. My experience with the
> *L*ibertarian self-identified is they seem to lean toward a
> virulent extremist willingness to *assert their will* on others
> under the guise of protecting *their will from subversion* .
> When I was younger (more juiced on the hormones and rhetoric and
> appeal of competition?) I was more seduced by some of that. Now
> it just makes me feel systemically ill.
>
> I don't know you well Carl, but from what I do think I know, you
> are clearly *very* independent and *very* considerate of others
> and their personal freedoms. That sounds pretty *l*ibertarian to
> me FWIW.
>
> - Steve
>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 12, 2020 at 8:48 AM Marcus Daniels
>> <marcus at snoutfarm.com <mailto:marcus at snoutfarm.com>> wrote:
>>
>> There is another aspect of staying behind which puts more
>> weight on maintaining local (e.g. family and childhood)
>> relationships. I don’t think this inclination is overtly
>> authoritarian. However, a strong desire to maintain a
>> social fabric could lead to policing mechanisms for them, and
>> that brings in (say) the church. When a social network is
>> more important than having any sort of purpose, weird things
>> happen. Wired has an article on some crazies up in Forks,
>> Washington that is worth a skim.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com
>> <mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com>> *On Behalf Of *David Eric
>> Smith
>> *Sent:* Monday, October 12, 2020 7:35 AM
>> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
>> <friam at redfish.com <mailto:friam at redfish.com>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] Political compass teest
>>
>>
>>
>> So this is metastasizing now, and there have been other
>> decades when it wasn’t such a problem, or at least not as overt.
>>
>>
>>
>> Is that due to demographic sorting? In more prosperous (or
>> even just earlier) times, enough people stayed near where
>> they were born that cultures got some mix of preferences, and
>> you didn’t have whole regions “submitting too much to the
>> authorities in their lives”. But when those who wanted out
>> could get out, and did so systematically, the ones who stayed
>> behind could create a tailored paradise for the preferences
>> that had caused them to stay behind?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2020, at 10:19 AM, Roger Critchlow
>> <rec at elf.org <mailto:rec at elf.org>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/10/12/trump-voter-authoritarian-research/
>>
>>
>>
>> -- rec --
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 11, 2020 at 12:27 AM Marcus Daniels
>> <marcus at snoutfarm.com <mailto:marcus at snoutfarm.com>> wrote:
>>
>> There’s a page on the 2020 election where they claim,
>> among other strange things, that Warren is a
>> right-leaning authoritarian. If that is true, which
>> I doubt, it says to me politicians are mirroring the
>> electorate in a very obscure way. And I am pretty
>> sure I am not far to the left of Bernie Sanders.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com
>> <mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com>> *On Behalf Of
>> *Stephen Guerin
>> *Sent:* Saturday, October 10, 2020 8:39 PM
>> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee
>> Group <friam at redfish.com <mailto:friam at redfish.com>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] Political compass teest
>>
>>
>>
>> ec=-5.75 & soc=-6.3
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 9:18 PM
>> <thompnickson2 at gmail.com
>> <mailto:thompnickson2 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I’m more of a libertarian than Dave is?
>> Something MUST be wrong, here.
>>
>>
>>
>> Nicholas Thompson
>>
>> Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
>>
>> Clark University
>>
>> ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com
>> <mailto:ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com>
>>
>> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/
>> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwordpress.clarku.edu%2fnthompson%2f&c=E,1,U3OccPSjskXK4svW9X1qk3Vv7E5UwkKy9mLBuwBfoPfJKYxJ6aCBK0PVs7udT_TYGhprp1R603GJlx6xKqM35rw3C-x7J0zwGZ6_tMf3hqMPHZB64xRxPw,,&typo=1>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com
>> <mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com>> *On Behalf Of
>> *Prof David West
>> *Sent:* Saturday, October 10, 2020 6:39 PM
>> *To:* friam at redfish.com <mailto:friam at redfish.com>
>> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] Political compass teest
>>
>>
>>
>> Econ left/right: -0.88
>>
>> Social Lib/Auth: -6.1
>>
>>
>>
>> davew
>>
>> NOT a Libertarian
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 10, 2020, at 5:56
>> PM, thompnickson2 at gmail.com
>> <mailto:thompnickson2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Do we all agree at an insanely high level?
>> Then wtf have we been arguing about all these
>> years. Let’s wait until Glen and Dave take
>> the test before we bury all our hatchets.
>>
>>
>>
>> n
>>
>>
>>
>> Nicholas Thompson
>>
>> Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology
>>
>> Clark University
>>
>> ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com
>> <mailto:ThompNickSon2 at gmail.com>
>>
>> https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/
>> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwordpress.clarku.edu%2fnthompson%2f&c=E,1,jI9pg2_C34oOCpyabOwNVYM7KJGCPx7H3EupAcE2q9TK2V75UO7IrMX_UOS1TIZ0puSAcbRFu09JGz8yK4gzt6DIJCqNtiA3EEOMsqYT64DoqXJS7TM,&typo=1>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com
>> <mailto:friam-bounces at redfish.com>> *On
>> Behalf Of *Gary Schiltz
>>
>> *Sent:* Saturday, October 10, 2020 5:29 PM
>>
>> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity
>> Coffee Group <friam at redfish.com
>> <mailto:friam at redfish.com>>
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] Political compass teest
>>
>>
>>
>> I was pretty much dead center in the lower
>> left quadrant, which was surprising to me. I
>> would have thought I would be in the middle
>> of the whole graph.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 10, 2020 at 4:52 PM George Duncan
>> <gtduncan at gmail.com
>> <mailto:gtduncan at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Jon, I took it. I'm barely left on
>> economics and strongly libertarian on
>> social issues
>>
>>
>>
>> George Duncan
>>
>> Emeritus Professor of Statistics,
>> Carnegie Mellon University
>>
>> georgeduncanart.com
>> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fgeorgeduncanart.com%2f&c=E,1,7A1nvLLwvbARh5EsbrcBP_x1ncqDWHW84o2ARPieWFtHxbGsgklMKBqeuNgbEd_czryT4FTxDDbM2mCDHXdJbmd_5-i0Yf4oVpAGGN27uHZ8&typo=1>
>>
>> See posts on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram
>>
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>>
>>
>> My art theme: Dynamic exposition of the
>> tension between matrix order and luminous
>> chaos.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Attempt what is not certain. Certainty
>> may or may not come later. It may then be
>> a valuable delusion."
>>
>> From "Notes to myself on beginning a
>> painting" by Richard Diebenkorn.
>>
>> "It's that knife-edge of uncertainty
>> where we come alive to our truest power."
>> Joanna Macy.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 10, 2020 at 3:22 PM jon
>> zingale <jonzingale at gmail.com
>> <mailto:jonzingale at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I just took the political compass
>> test and surprise surprise, I am a
>>
>> left-libertarian.
>>
>>
>>
>> Take the test here if you are interested:
>>
>> https://www.politicalcompass.org/test
>> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.politicalcompass.org%2ftest&c=E,1,e8hAuyhPdtiZ876M9sd6OmWzNeLJXSYR8MHrODvh3vN2g_nLrK21RY_5OBeUJlK4p0Rzh08Ymx64c4LiIgp7JiIDXXzqbbqx3zHFw_W8CPvxLq3_SnjwgA,,&typo=1>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
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