[FRIAM] The entropy of thought

[steve smith]

> There will be a fate vs. the fate is knowable.  Not sure why people 
> bring that distinction up as interesting.
>
Shakespeare?

  * when I first (age 12-16?)  encountered Xtian whack jobs who
    confronted *MY* illusion of /free will/ with *THEIR* illusion of
    /God-figure-given predetermination/ , an ill-formed version of the
    question began.
  * Godel and Turing added a nice formalism into my budding sense of
    "all things computational" over the next 5-10 years.
  * Complexity Science put it into a more interesting (and complex)
    frame for me over the next 10 years...
  * The current wave of ML/AI has retriggered it for me.  But we know
    I'm an easy mark.
  * Quantum theoretic and particularly computational framings, as well
    as Digital Physics (ala Fredkin/Wolfram/et-al) give it a whole new
    spiciness.

I'm off to do my twice-weekly water-walking meditation, perhaps such 
will help me recognize that all above are in fact un-interesting.

> *From:*Friam <friam-bounces at redfish.com> *On Behalf Of *steve smith
> *Sent:* Thursday, May 29, 2025 8:13 AM
> *To:* friam at redfish.com
> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] The entropy of thought
>
>
>
>     < The interesting question is where exactly does the deterministic
>     system turn into something nondeterministic, and how?>
>
>     It doesn’t.  A deterministic system is a deterministic system.
>
> who might have first made the distinction : "deterministic but not 
> pre-stateable"?
>
> George offered:
>
> *Year*
>
> 	
>
> *Thinker*
>
> 	
>
> *Conceptual Expression*
>
> 1931
>
> 	
>
> Kurt Gödel
>
> 	
>
> Incompleteness: truths not derivable
>
> 1936
>
> 	
>
> Alan Turing
>
> 	
>
> Halting problem: uncomputable predictions
>
> 1970s
>
> 	
>
> Heinz von Foerster
>
> 	
>
> Second-order cybernetics: unknowability of future
>
> 1991
>
> 	
>
> Robert Rosen
>
> 	
>
> Closure to efficient causation; entailment limits
>
> 1993
>
> 	
>
> Stuart Kauffman
>
> 	
>
> Adjacent possible; unprestatable evolution
>
> 2005
>
> 	
>
> Gregory Chaitin
>
> 	
>
> Incompressible but defined numbers (e.g., Ω)
>
>
> .- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / ... --- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-..
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